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The HOW & WHY of Alternators, Batteries and big stereo systems

litch

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Just a brain dump of things to take note of when designing your stereo system, no matter how powerful.

The Alternator
Understanding the Alternator's role is paramount to a solid power supply and thus a solid sound system - because it is _THE_ power supply.

People always tend to throw an extra battery in the boot, change the stock battery for a high performance model or add polyfarad capacitors to solve problems like amp cut-out, headlight dimming or poor sub performance but that's not addressing the actual issue, and more just re-enforcing the car's last resort to supply power.

Why?
An alternator will supply somewhere in the 13 - 15V range when the engine is running, and under load - it will continue to supply that voltage as far as it possibly can depending on engine RPM and the capacity of that specific alternator. Anywhere in that realm, of very little power draw right up to near its maximum limit - your whole car's electrics are being run off the alternator - even the battery is being charged (taking current) and not lending a single milliamp to the operation of the electrics.

But, as soon as you get near the alternator's maximum load, it will start to drop voltage, down, down, all the way to around the battery/batteries present - and that's when they they come into play.

The Battery
Like the alternator, the battery will also drop its voltage - but as soon as your start drawing current. This is not not a straight (linear) line, drawing 100A will not drop 10x the voltage as drawing 10A.

Also "Cranking Amps". Manufacturers go on to further define the maximum current draw depending on temperature (Cold Cranking Amps, Hot Cranking Amps) as the battery's ability to produce current (the chemical reaction is inherently dependant on the catalyst of heat) - but for the most part, you'll usually see CCA (Cold Cranking Amps) used which means that at some temperature (usually -18C) this is the current the battery can produce without dropping voltage below X, where X is usually somewhere around 7V to 10V depending on which manufacturer you talk to. That last part should immediately ring alarm bells as to the reliability of using the CCA rating (as its definition can differ so much between OEMs).

In any case, most modern cars will have a battery that can do several hundred CCA, but in terms of car audio we don't want the battery voltage to drop anywhere below about 12.0V (which usually means amp-cutout or those other issues I noted above).

So, choosing the battery (or batteries) is arguably just as important as picking the right alternator. If you've got a whopping 10KW system, it's going to want to pull somewhere around the 600-800Amps in peak requirements. No alternator is going to match that. Your basic high-output alternator is 170A-200A, so you've got to make up the 400-600Amp with multiple batteries that will handle that deficit without dropping voltage too far as to impact performance. Remember that the lower the voltage supplied to the Amp, the less power it can give to the speakers/subs.

Big3 and other wires
Provided you've spec'd out an alternator with one or more batteries are quite able to handle your loudest song with the high-beams on at night and the fan full cranked, then you should probably check your wiring at the same time.

Voltage drop is the killer of all audio systems and it caused by one (or both) of the following:
* Maximum supply current (Alt/Bat)
* Series resistance

We've already dealt with the top point in the sections above, but we need to address series resistance.

When dealing with low voltage (12V) and huge amounts of current (100A+) from very low resistive loads (Amps) the size of the wire interconnecting the circuit (Ground->Alt->Bat->Amps->Ground) and the terminals, plugs and everything in between plays a big role.

First rule: Each section of a circuit drop the voltage relative to its resistance over the total circuit resistance.
Second rule: The voltage drop across all sections equals the source/supply voltage. Thus, when you have 1 section (like when measuring the battery directly on each terminal) you see the source voltage (being the battery itself).

If you didn't get that, here's a simplified workout:
A 1200W Amp will draw 100A off 12V (Power = Volts x Amps).
At that point, pretending there is zero resistance elsewhere, it has a resistance of 0.12Ohms (R=V/I).
But, if we made the positive battery terminal have a poor connection which incurred a very small 0.01Ohm resistance. The total circuit resistance would be 0.13 Ohms. Thus the battery terminal would drop the voltage relative to it's resistance (0.01/0.13) which equates to about 1 volt. The amp would then be only left with 11V which would instantly take 200W off your amp's power capability (1000W).

So, in reference to the Big3 - Make sure you
* Clean all contacts/terminals
* Make sure all joins are solid
* Use 4AWG at the very least

And that includes:
* Alternator to chassis
* Alternator to battery
* Battery to Amps
* Other grounds/junctions you have

Farad Block Capacitors

They behave like a small battery, storing charge and discharging it to your audio amps when required. Though it's a bit of a double edged sword as once discharged, they too want power to recharge thus being in competition with your amps.

To quantify what these caps can do:
1 farad is equivalent to supplying 13Amps in a 1 second (@ 13V charge)

20 farad block can do 260A in 1 second.

Note that there are a few other metrics that come into play such as ESR and other resistances, but I won't get into that in too much detail, just know that a 20 Farad block won't supply 2,600A in 1 millisecond.

Rule of thumb: If you play long deep notes, don't use one. If you prefer songs with punchy short drum kicks, maybe it'll help but in both cases, perhaps look elsewhere for the solution (Alt/Bat/Wires)
 

Gouldinator1

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Great information.

A point on capacitors. A lot of development has happened in this area in the last few years. Instead of getting useless caps at 1 farad you can now get caps up to 3000 farad.

Maxwell super and ultra capacitors are one such brand. The Black Nasty (a ute/truck in the US) replaced his battery bank with a bank of capacitors and had the same output and result. The main benefit was the saving in weight and charge time. It is a pretty interesting development in the car audio world.

Just note it is hard to find lots of Maxwell capacitors and they cost a bucket load.
 

litch

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Great information.
The Black Nasty (a ute/truck in the US) replaced his battery bank with a bank of capacitors and had the same output and result.

True - if you're doing pure SPL, and 'burping' your system - caps are great; they charge to max and you let it fly through the system in a 1 - 2 second burst to get that dB readout.

Playing music on the other hand may encounter that issue of when the amps hit power notes and suck the caps dry - you're left with empty cap(s) and an Amp that wants more juice for the next beat (thus depriving it of maximum power).

Tricky situation.
 

Gouldinator1

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True - if you're doing pure SPL, and 'burping' your system - caps are great; they charge to max and you let it fly through the system in a 1 - 2 second burst to get that dB readout.

Playing music on the other hand may encounter that issue of when the amps hit power notes and suck the caps dry - you're left with empty cap(s) and an Amp that wants more juice for the next beat (thus depriving it of maximum power).

Tricky situation.

It is an interesting idea. In the case of Black Nasty it lands more on the side of crazy. 192 3000 farad caps for a total of 160000 farad, plus his charging system, allows him to demo besides just burping but I do get your point. That build is just over the top.
 

litch

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That build is just over the top.

Just some interesting math behind that to show exactly how "over the top" it is...

In those 160KF of capacitors @ 14V lies the power to run a standard house for half the day (8KWH) or a 60W light bulb for 5 days and 12 hours (ignoring leakage current).

Crazy gives too much credit! :p

Reference:
Code:
Faraday's law is F=J/V²

Farads = Joules / Volts²

Joules = Farads x Volts²

Also, 1 Joule = Supplying 1 Amp of current for 1 second.
And, 1 million Joules = 0.27777* KWh's
 

Gouldinator1

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You have to remember he is loading and unloading that power every few seconds (probably less). I thought it was interesting because he only has 1 battery and all those caps supporting a 30,000W system.
 

litch

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You have to remember he is loading and unloading that power every few seconds (probably less). I thought it was interesting because he only has 1 battery and all those caps supporting a 30,000W system.

He would need to supply a quarter megawatt in 2 seconds (to charge the caps in that time), and the largest alternators available are a around 1/500th of that power. Even multiples of those alternators (5, 10 alternators) doesn't even get close before you get to being totally infeasible. So, while he probably waits quite some time for the bank to fully charge before doing a run - at full charge, 30KW would still take around 15 minutes to discharge the cap bank at that constant level (not including the alternator putting some back in) and (music wouldn't take that level of power 100% of the time).

Still, it blows all the usual math to do with car stereos out the window. Whole different kettle of bass...
 

Gouldinator1

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every few seconds (probably less)

My above assumption was wrong (I was lazy and didn't look it up). You are right it would take sometime to charge and sometime to discharge. The 4 340 amp mechman alternators help the situation but don't work in the timeframes I was assuming.

Whole different kettle of bass...

Totally agree.
 
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