Welcome to Just Commodores, a site specifically designed for all people who share the same passion as yourself.

New Posts Contact us

Just Commodores Forum Community

It takes just a moment to join our fantastic community

Register

The light finally dawns - speeding isn't the major cause of most crashes

immortality

Can't live without smoky bacon!
Staff member
Joined
Apr 15, 2006
Messages
18,775
Reaction score
9,381
Points
113
Location
Sth Auck, NZ
Members Ride
HSV VS Senator, VX s2 Calais S/C
WOW, the truth has reared it's ugly head

Police focus on speed questioned - National - NZ Herald News

Unfortunately it seems the police just aren't willing to acknowledge the facts. It's interesting to hear the facts from Stu Kearns, a former police officer who spent many years working in the serious crash unit.

It seems that the article does demonstrate the police mentality of easy ticketing for speeding (aka revenue gathering) rather then doing more intensive police work for acts that involve smaller fines (stopping for a stop sign and red light running etc).

I for one, would be happy to see a red light camera at every major intersection in the country with much larger fines imposed. Red light running is a chronic problem ( I see it occur almost on a daily basis), worse than speeding in my book. Of course, more cops patrolling intersections would be even better.
 

Evil Empire

Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2013
Messages
95
Reaction score
0
Points
6
Location
Australia
Members Ride
VE Calais V
It's statistically proven that suicide kills more males aged 15-35 per year than road accidents.

Maybe the police can start to consider this and let us enjoy our cars instead of adding to our depression by over policing.
 

commodore665

expat Saffa
Joined
Dec 30, 2011
Messages
2,842
Reaction score
2,232
Points
113
Age
52
Location
New Zealand via Cape Town
Members Ride
2005 SV6 & Alfa Romeo 156 V6
WOW, the truth has reared it's ugly head

Police focus on speed questioned - National - NZ Herald News

Unfortunately it seems the police just aren't willing to acknowledge the facts. It's interesting to hear the facts from Stu Kearns, a former police officer who spent many years working in the serious crash unit.

It seems that the article does demonstrate the police mentality of easy ticketing for speeding (aka revenue gathering) rather then doing more intensive police work for acts that involve smaller fines (stopping for a stop sign and red light running etc).

I for one, would be happy to see a red light camera at every major intersection in the country with much larger fines imposed. Red light running is a chronic problem ( I see it occur almost on a daily basis), worse than speeding in my book. Of course, more cops patrolling intersections would be even better.

I kind of agree with this , if people paid attention while driving , it doesn't matter whether its at 100kph or 120kph or even at 50 kph , there would bw fewer accidents , and while I agree that red light and stop sign running are a problem , the person that gets ticketed , may still accuse the Officer of revenue gathering , so it really is a catch 22 , and drinking and driving and being under the influence of drugs , well it it doesn't take a brain surgeon to work out that doesn't always end well .
 

c2105026

Active Member
Joined
Aug 9, 2009
Messages
900
Reaction score
139
Points
43
Location
NSW
Members Ride
2000 VTII Commodore Olympic, 2012 Ford Focus ST
You very well could look at this from the perspective of statistic analysis.

We are told 40% of fatal crashes feature a speeding vehicle. The initial speed surveys done by the NSW RTA in the late 1990s suggests that about 40-50% of the traffic flow is speeding at any given moment. This would suggest that, therefore, if you are speeding you are not overrepresented in fatal traffic crashes.

In the 1990s report done by MUARC that says 'go 65 in a 60 zone double your risk of a crash', 68% of the crashes were NOT caused by a speeding vehicle, rather a noob that did not yield right of way. Additionally at each crash site only one 'case' vehicle crash was recorded (was about 200 crashes) and only 4 controls (you need at least about 30 to get a 'normal' distribution). This gets you a very wide margin of error. Then all crash sites were lumped together implying they all have same safety risk. I can say having studied and practiced road engineering this is not true. I had a chapter about this in a final year thesis/asignment when I studied Civil Engineering, topic being 'Reducing Risk on Australian Roads'

Finally, when I was working for RTA, in 2005-2006 I was in the head road safety office on a 6 month placement as part of the graduate program. Some stories there. 1 - in one project I was given 860 highway crashes to analyse from the aspect of clearzones (i.e. removing trees from edge of highways so people didn't hit them). These crashes straight from our database only indicated 40 of these 860 crashes featured people who were actually over the posted speed limit. Another couple of hundred were people who lost it on a bend; regardless of the speed they were travelling in the NSW this is always regarded as 'speeding' even though they may be under the limit (but heaps were...). 2 - I attended a workshop looking at biker safety on the old pacific highway. Initial brainstorming session was 'what is causing these accidents'. 'Speed'. 'Alcohol'. I say 'lack of attention'. facilitator says, ok, fatigue. I say 'no, not paying attention, not having your mind on the job'. 'Ok, fatigue it is' :bang:
 

immortality

Can't live without smoky bacon!
Staff member
Joined
Apr 15, 2006
Messages
18,775
Reaction score
9,381
Points
113
Location
Sth Auck, NZ
Members Ride
HSV VS Senator, VX s2 Calais S/C
I know it's something Minux has said many times, driver in-attention is the biggest problem. I totally agree with him ( I don't think we agree on many other issues).

As I've been trying to teach my boys, one who will be getting his learners in the next year, you don't just watch the car in front of you, you need to watch what is happening 5-10 seconds ahead of you so that you can react to any potential problem before it happens, it's saved my bacon a few times. It's also why I don't like sitting behind large 4x4's and people movers, you just can't see anything around them.


I kind of agree with this , if people paid attention while driving , it doesn't matter whether its at 100kph or 120kph or even at 50 kph , there would bw fewer accidents , and while I agree that red light and stop sign running are a problem , the person that gets ticketed , may still accuse the Officer of revenue gathering , so it really is a catch 22 , and drinking and driving and being under the influence of drugs , well it it doesn't take a brain surgeon to work out that doesn't always end well .

Yep, everything seems like revenue gathering, that is unfortunate (I know I beat that drum hard and loud with reference to speeding). I still say that an officer handing you a ticket at the time of the offence is the best deterrent but red light cameras I have no issue with as it's a deadly problem. I remember the days (when younger) that you could drag race (cough cough) from the lights at any major intersection, these days I don't leave from a green light until I have checked left and right and even when travelling through an intersection I still check left and right, paranoid maybe but unfortunately it is required these days :(

You very well could look at this from the perspective of statistic analysis.

We are told 40% of fatal crashes feature a speeding vehicle. The initial speed surveys done by the NSW RTA in the late 1990s suggests that about 40-50% of the traffic flow is speeding at any given moment. This would suggest that, therefore, if you are speeding you are not overrepresented in fatal traffic crashes.

In the 1990s report done by MUARC that says 'go 65 in a 60 zone double your risk of a crash', 68% of the crashes were NOT caused by a speeding vehicle, rather a noob that did not yield right of way. Additionally at each crash site only one 'case' vehicle crash was recorded (was about 200 crashes) and only 4 controls (you need at least about 30 to get a 'normal' distribution). This gets you a very wide margin of error. Then all crash sites were lumped together implying they all have same safety risk. I can say having studied and practiced road engineering this is not true. I had a chapter about this in a final year thesis/asignment when I studied Civil Engineering, topic being 'Reducing Risk on Australian Roads'

Finally, when I was working for RTA, in 2005-2006 I was in the head road safety office on a 6 month placement as part of the graduate program. Some stories there. 1 - in one project I was given 860 highway crashes to analyse from the aspect of clearzones (i.e. removing trees from edge of highways so people didn't hit them). These crashes straight from our database only indicated 40 of these 860 crashes featured people who were actually over the posted speed limit. Another couple of hundred were people who lost it on a bend; regardless of the speed they were travelling in the NSW this is always regarded as 'speeding' even though they may be under the limit (but heaps were...). 2 - I attended a workshop looking at biker safety on the old pacific highway. Initial brainstorming session was 'what is causing these accidents'. 'Speed'. 'Alcohol'. I say 'lack of attention'. facilitator says, ok, fatigue. I say 'no, not paying attention, not having your mind on the job'. 'Ok, fatigue it is' :bang:

Yes, changing attitudes and deep seated miss-conceptions unfortunately takes far to long.
 

87RB30VL

Swiggidy Swag
Joined
Feb 22, 2011
Messages
1,100
Reaction score
12
Points
38
Age
35
Location
North Brisbane
Website
www.facebook.com
Members Ride
09' FG XR6 Falcon, 75' HJ Kingswood Ute
As I've been trying to teach my boys, one who will be getting his learners in the next year, you don't just watch the car in front of you, you need to watch what is happening 5-10 seconds ahead of you so that you can react to any potential problem before it happens, it's saved my bacon a few times. It's also why I don't like sitting behind large 4x4's and people movers, you just can't see anything around them.

I hate it too, massive Hilux's with their 10" lift and huge 30" offroad tyres, one minute you're cruising along, nek minnit they've slammed their brakes on and you have no idea wtf is going on ahead
 

yxyx64

New Member
Joined
Feb 25, 2012
Messages
471
Reaction score
1
Points
0
Location
nsw
Members Ride
Kia turbo + Holden badge, Chev badge in Texas
If you are paying attention you would NOT be exceeding the speed limit. The "everyone does it" defense only goes so far before every Catholic Priest is allowed to...........cause everyone does it.
 

c2105026

Active Member
Joined
Aug 9, 2009
Messages
900
Reaction score
139
Points
43
Location
NSW
Members Ride
2000 VTII Commodore Olympic, 2012 Ford Focus ST
A big difference between speeding and say drink driving is that speeding can be done and is often always done unwittingly; bit heavy on the gas, going downhill, past a radar trap, ka-ching. Drink driving and even failing to wear a seatbelt often involves a conscious decision to do said behaviour.
 

Reaper

Tells it like it is.
Joined
Aug 15, 2004
Messages
6,456
Reaction score
9,080
Points
113
Location
SE Suburbs, Melbourne
Members Ride
RG Z71 Colorado, 120 Prado , VDJ200 Landcruiser
I hate it too, massive Hilux's with their 10" lift and huge 30" offroad tyres, one minute you're cruising along, nek minnit they've slammed their brakes on and you have no idea wtf is going on ahead

I am in total agreement - add VL commodores that just randomly break down and stop at any given moment and you have at least the cause of 90% of crashes right there :)
 

Calaber

Nil Bastardo Carborundum
Joined
Nov 29, 2007
Messages
4,334
Reaction score
1,353
Points
113
Location
Lower Hunter Region NSW
Members Ride
CG Captiva 5 Series 2
you don't just watch the car in front of you, you need to watch what is happening 5-10 seconds ahead of you so that you can react to any potential problem before it happens,

Guilty as charged. Last week I drove clean through a red light because my mind wasn't on the job and I was watching the car ahead, not the road ahead. The intersection has a red light camera so I'm expecting the ticket any day now.

Absolutely no excuse. I had my eighteen month old grand-daughter and wife in the car, so the offence is even more serious. As a long time driver, my inattention could have had fatal consequences. I'm not embarrassed to admit my foolishness, but I'm damned disappointed in myself.
 
Top