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VF Clubsport Manual Wagon

Discussion in 'VF Holden Commodore (2013 - 2017)' started by Subju, Jan 23, 2020.

  1. Subju

    Subju New Member

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    Could I please get some help with the following questions specifically regarding the VF Manual Clubsport Wagons?

    1. Are there VF Clubsports and VF R8 Clubsports variants or all of them the same VF R8 Clubsports?
    2. Am I right that there is only 2 x VF Clubsports - 2013 VF Clubsport and a 2014 Clubsport available?
    3. Is there any difference between a 2013 VF Clubsport and a VF 2014 Clubsport?
    4. Is it accurate to say that there have only been a total of 232 (VF 2013) and 95 (VF 2014) cars ever made?
    5. Out of those cars, how many would be a manual?
    6. I can't see any of these for sale at the moment, how much do you think they will go for if one comes up for sale in the next 2 months?
    7. What chance that one of these will come up do you think?
    8. How much better is the VF Clubsport LS3 than the E3 LS3 and how much more of a premium would you pay before just going for the E3?
    9. Which would you choose from the 3 options on redbook link below?

    https://hsvdatabase.com.au/hsv-vf-clubsport-r8/

    http://beta.redbook.com.au/compare/?ids=SPOT-ITM-331570,SPOT-ITM-383283,SPOT-ITM-323466

    Thanks so much in advance, I'm going on a trip around Australia and I want to spend some money holidaying in some of the drought areas to help out small businesses after the fires.
     
  2. Forg

    Forg Well-Known Member

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    For #1, all wagons are R8's.
    For #2, correct.
    Can't answer #3, sorry, but not aware of any differences.
    For #4 & #5 no idea; but the manuals are very rare. I think I've only ever seen 2 for sale in CarSales, and I've been looking just out of interest at least every 3 months since we bought our Commodore in 2015.
    For #6, the ones I saw for sale were only asking about the same money as a sedan. But the older they get, the more likely they are to go to an enthusiast rather than someone who just wants to be seen in a nice car, so I think manuals will be commanding a premium by now ... I think they'd probably achieve an extra ~$5k, but that's really a guess.
    For #7 ... it will, eventually. Depends how long you want to wait. If you're looking to go on hols before winter, you might not be going in the R8 Tourer, though.
    For #8 I don't think there was a mechanical difference with the engine, although it appears the optional SV Pack (which takes the engine up to 340kW) was introduced for VF (the manuals I've seen for sale both had the 340 badge).

    As for the "whether to Gen-E3 or Gen-F" question ... I don't think I can answer that (I don't believe HSV's published fuel economy in that comparison BTW - I reckon they'd be near identical & in fact if E3 got the under-body aero it's probably slipperier on the highway). I reckon they'd feel slighly different to drive, same as the VE2-VF difference, with the Gen-F being quieter & more supple while handling as-well-or-better. And the Gen-F interior is nowhere near as 1994-spec base-model Hyundai Excel. But hey, the Gen-E3 gets a proper handbrake.
    I don't think the price difference between them will be as low as is shown on that RedBook page; if it was, I wouldn't buy the E3.
     
  3. Derekthetree

    Derekthetree Active Member

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    I did a bit of research before and after buying my MY15 R8 sedan manual in May 19.

    I saw no manual HSV wagons for sale, maybe one manual wagon redline?
    Can't comment on E3 vs F. I wanted a more modern interior so didn't even drive any Es

    The wikipedia entry is remarkably detailed for changes to the model, see below.
    An addition I can make is that for MY15 they merged the SV pack with the R8, so you get slight power increase and black accents.

    If you get one, you'll love it!

    The ClubSport is the entry-level sedan in the HSV range. Based on Commodore SS. It is powered by a 6.2-litre LS3 V8 engine, with power and torque figures of 317 kW (425 hp) and 550 N⋅m (410 lb⋅ft). The ClubSport R8 (based on SSV/Redline) variant has a more powerful engine 325Kw (with an extra 15 kW (20 hp) of power and 20 N⋅m (15 lb⋅ft)) and minor visual changes compared to the standard ClubSport, including SV badges.[33] The ClubSport R8 Tourer is the station wagon version. All ClubSport models feature 20-inch wheels and standard six-speed manual transmission or optional six-speed automatic.

    In November 2014, as part of the MY15 update, the power was increased to 325 kW (436 hp) for the base ClubSport and 340 kW (460 hp) for the R8.

    In July 2015, HSV launched the limited edition Clubsport R8 25th Anniversary to commemorate the nameplate. It did not benefit from any performance increases but only extra fitments that included forged alloy wheels and special badges and trims. Production totalled 108 units (eight of which for export to New Zealand).[34]

    In 2016, R8 model was reintroduced with downtuned LSA supercharged V8, rated at 400 kW (540 hp).
     
  4. Forg

    Forg Well-Known Member

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    The HSV ones are rare, but at least they were officially available ... Holden didn't offer a manual wagon of any sort for VF or VF-II, however yes I've seen one Redline for sale & figured it was either a special order for a very valued customer or someone was keen enough to convert one (either that or it was a mistake - it was a dealer ad, they could pretty easily have forgotten what the car was that they were selling & switched interior photos from a manual Redline by mistake, and the person placing the ad could have been judging whether it was manual from the photos without even knowing that it was extremely unusual).

    Yes, but no manual wagon after MY14. :(
    I suspect the two I've seen for sale had the SV pack because the Tourers were basically the most expensive Clubbie you could get, so they figured the extra cost of the SV pack was irrelevant given what they were already paying ... and being manuals they'd have been enthusiasts rather than just buying a big loud look-at-me. :)
     
  5. Derekthetree

    Derekthetree Active Member

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    I didn't realise that, seems an odd choice given they would be interspersing manual sedans on the line?

    I underestimated this factor. I'm from UK where probably 90% of cars are manual and almost everyone learns in one, so its nothing special.
    I went for a spin with some local guys last weekend who have mainly older stuff. They finally noticed mine was manual. I got a bit more respect after that!

    PS: notice you have a Regal Peacock car too, lovely colour and absolutely sold me my car.
     
  6. Subju

    Subju New Member

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    Really appreciate the answers guys. I might get lucky, the more I read about it, the more my heart is set on the VF Manual Wagon Clubby.

    Frustrating that they decided to stop putting the manuals into them.

    Is there any real difference apart from the shapes between the wagon and sedan? I just showed my kids the wagon and they are like, the sedan looks heaps better. Maybe I could team up with them on the wife.
     
  7. Forg

    Forg Well-Known Member

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    I don't like putting down the children of people I don't even know, but yours are just plain downright incorrect.
    :D

    The wagon's about 50kg heavier if I remember correctly (a bit more glass, a bit more metal, and the tailgate's steel whereas VF sedan has an aluminium bootlid). But the body-styles are very similar in feel, from everything I've read. All suspension, brakes etc is the same, and from VE onwards the wagon's the same wheelbase as the sedan.
     
  8. Subju

    Subju New Member

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    :) Also, how much better is the VF interior over the E3? Any differences in mylink?

    I also read somewhere that the sound system is significantly worse in the wagon?
     
  9. Forg

    Forg Well-Known Member

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    There must be some cost-saving or they'd have continued to offer the manual to the few who'd buy one. It's hard to imagine that the parts required to fit a manual to a wagon are any different to the parts required to fit a manual to a sedan.
    My guess (no idea BTW) is that they ran wagons down the line in batches, and there was a cost-saving in not having to do that interspersing.

    Yes, we like it, and I am jealous of yours BTW! :)
    Not many around, being so close to black (and if you wanted black you'd have bought black).
    Ours has a bit of a story, my better-half had fully anthropomorphised the ecomoo '95 VS Berlina that had served us so well for 10 years, it was Sherbrooke Green (which is a little closer to British Racing Green than Regal Peacock - but still metallic), and when we decided to get a VF she felt it was less like discarding the old car she loved if it was "the same colour". Except that MY14 was the last year Holden offered Regal Peacock on a Redline ... and we were shopping in mid 2015.
    I scoured all dealer websites on the east coast looking for new or demo stock, luckily the ONE which was left was only a 1.5hr drive from home. :)
    It only had 70km on the clock when we drove it, the reason they'd not sold it was 'cos it had this hideous faux-woodgrain vinly down both sides & a flouro green surboard on the roof to make it look sorta like the classic Morris Minor "woodie" ... we bought it on the proviso the vinyl would come off & we'd never see that vinyl again. :)
    We did consider a MY15 Calais V as an alternative, but she didn't find the seats as comfy (which was good 'cos I wanted a Redline :)).

    Maybe what you've read is about the Redline, not the HSV? Redline wagons miss out on the BOSE system, I don't know about HSV's. My personal belief is that aftermarket sound is a trillionty times better, and if I cared that much about it I'd just get better speakers & sub installed (which isn't much extra when you consider what a Gen-F is worth).

    Google some images for the interior. The In Car Entertainment, SatNav etc system is totally different; frankly the SatNav works better in E3, but the whole unit & dash are better integrated in a VF. VE / E-series dashes look base-model-90's-Hyundai by comparison, but it's an appearance/ambience thing, it's not really any less functional (VE minor controls do have a tackier/cheaper feel but I doubt they're more likely to break).
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2020
  10. Subju

    Subju New Member

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    If anyone is in the hills area Sydney and wants a beer, let me know. You have all been so helpful.

    I've looked at a few yards now and I forgot just how scummy they are. Went to carcity the other day and had to argue with the guy to get a test drive after driving 40 minutes to get there. They are clueless as well, they didn't know **** about the cars.
     
  11. Forg

    Forg Well-Known Member

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    Yep ... mate of mine once got into a nearly-heated near-argument because we were both so sick of dealer crap & they guy tried to tell this mate that the Cressida with the (straight-six) 7MGE had a "big V6 engine". We showed him the spark-plugs all lined up, the manifolds, the fact there was only one head - he wouldn't have a bar of it, it was a "V6 mate".

    They're also generally pretty useless at doing business. I left a business card with the MrBishi dealer whose dealer-principal's 2.75yo Galant VR4 was coming up for sale in about 3 months, told them I'd buy it & how much I'd buy it for. 4 months later I was driving my new-to-me Liberty RS along the highway & there was the VR4 for sale on the yard, with an ask the same as I said I'd buy it for ...

    I may hold you to that ... I'll bring the Redline, you bring the brand-spankers (to you) manual Tourer! :D
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2020
  12. abuch47

    abuch47 Active Member

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    I went to drive a maloo gxp, told dealer I was not financially able to buy on phone. Got our car priced for trade in while he drove me to a cemetary and showed me over the car, then went on a test drive myself. The tonneau was worn he rolled it up to hang a dealer plate off the back and it rattled and swung in the breeze on 100kph roads the whole time asking me if I liked what I saw, like yeah maybe. He asks so what do we need to make this sale today, I'm like not today, "Lets get back and ask your partner". Get back writes up a contract for the advertised price says we can finance after, (wtf are you joking) manager comes out and both plead to tell me what I need of them to purchase today. Safe to say they pushed me away from a car i liked due to incompetence.
     
  13. Milo 6.0

    Milo 6.0 Active Member

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    My 2013 vf wagon is only an ssv but the stereo is the crappiest sounding of any car ive ever owned,sounds really rubbish,i realise it doesnt have a sub but even slightly better quality speakers would make it light years ahead of how it came stock.
    So yes the wagon stereo(speakers) is ****.
     
  14. VS 5.0

    VS 5.0 Well-Known Member

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    Just offer them $15k below asking.....they will back off quick smart.
     
  15. Forg

    Forg Well-Known Member

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    I agree it’s pretty bad, but I’ve had a few rentals in recent years & they’ve all been just as bad. Koleos (which had BOSE written all over it), ASX, mid-spec Camry, mid-spec Corolla, diesel Jag XE, mid-spec Golf, mid-spec Astra wagon. All basically pretty awful. Mind you, I didn’t notice the same reduction in sound-quality over Bluetooth in the two cars I had the longest (the Golf & XE) as I get in the Commodore.
     
  16. Subju

    Subju New Member

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    Is there a difference btn stereo from VF Wagon and VF Clubsport Wagon Milo?
     
  17. Forg

    Forg Well-Known Member

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    Checking the standard equipment list in RedBook, the R8 Tourer lists the ICE as 6-speaker (same description as the SSV Redline wagon) and the R8 list the ICE as 9-speaker (same as the SSV Redline sedan). Mesuspects the speakers are the same not-so-hotness.

    If our wagon were my daily rather than the better-half’s daily, I’d replace the existing speakers with some reasonable splits & use the copious under-front-seat room to fit some under-seat subs. And stick with the MyLink head-unit.
     
  18. Milo 6.0

    Milo 6.0 Active Member

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    Tbh mate i dont know,you would hope so.
    I would have loved a clubby wagon!
    Im looking into getting speaker spacers and some decent speakers to fit in the factory location some time in the future,i dont drive my wagon often,maybe once a week so its not a huge issue,it will happen one day:)
     
  19. Milo 6.0

    Milo 6.0 Active Member

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    My daily is a 2008 bf xr6 sedan and the premium sound absolutely kills the newer vf,sounds so much better even for a scabby old 2008 factory bf stereo lol,kind of sad tbh,not really a good comparison i know,even the wifes 2017 dmax dual cab stereo is better.
    Its not the end of the world,few hundred $$$$$$ and a few hours time will sort it out,i have to be super keen and in the right mindset to mess with car stereos,they can be a big pita.
     
  20. Subju

    Subju New Member

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    My daily is a BF GTP that is getting really long in the tooth at 310k :(. Sounds like I will need to spend some money on the stereo as the family will be using it as our daily and the GT will be used only when we need a second vehicle.
     

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