Vn v8 mace cam kits

[EYY]

How much r and d do you think was done specifically for the 304? You don't think maybe they found some things that worked , why they worked and did other things similar to fill the gap?

With durations similar to each other you've only got timing and lift to worry about. The new love profiles by lunati have more lift than the old crow and crane.

They also have reverse and standard split. Reverse to help the tpi style banana intake manifold cheat the low compression and out of breath.

Or the other direction because cold air flows easier than hot air and the VN exhaust ports don't work as well as intake.

They even do straight symmetrical grinds.

Almost every single camshaft if you look at the timing cards for a Holden is based on SBC opening and closing and just with some duration difference in the middle no-how.

Sure they have options - even crane cams don’t get that great a wrap for the 304’s in reality. Camtech, Kelford, Wade and Clive cams were the companies to go to for 304 grinds.

Anybody could just pluck specs of the internet and alter durations slightly and add a little bit of lift and be confident that it’ll work. They’re a dinosaur engine, and aren’t that fussy for the most part.

I’m not putting down their cams at all, they may have invested plenty of money, purchased plenty of Aussie vehicles and run each of their cams in hundreds of 304’s.

Just saying I’d tend to stick with a company that’s renowned for their 304 cams here in Aus. And if we don’t support Australian manufacturing now, it’ll be gone forever.

 

[Immortality]

These days you are picking lobe profiles to suit the engine in a configuration that works best for that engine whether it be forward or reverse split, more or less lift, LSA etc.

Good cam companies actually list their lobes with full info. Your basic cam card will tell you advertised and .050" durations and lobe lift and LSA etc, a better guide will actually give you .100, .200,.300 duration numbers so you can truly see and compare lobe profiles.

 

[harrop.senator]

Sure they have options - even crane cams don’t get that great a wrap for the 304’s in reality. Camtech, Kelford, Wade and Clive cams were the companies to go to for 304 grinds.

Anybody could just pluck specs of the internet and alter durations slightly and add a little bit of lift and be confident that it’ll work. They’re a dinosaur engine, and aren’t that fussy for the most part.

I’m not putting down their cams at all, they may have invested plenty of money, purchased plenty of Aussie vehicles and run each of their cams in hundreds of 304’s.

Just saying I’d tend to stick with a company that’s renowned for their 304 cams here in Aus. And if we don’t support Australian manufacturing now, it’ll be gone forever.

Kelford doesn't list off the shelf grinds for any 304 only ls and straight six Holden.

Camtech hasn't been open in over a year and are permanently closed.

Clive's been running camshaft software to plot the cams for at least 5-10 years since my mate Rob was a machinist there. Or they'd literally take profiles from others that were similar to what it seems you'd want. Grind the advance in to them so the valve opening point is correct.

Also agree on Crane cams aren't that great for a 304 , they should be running split patterns and not symmetrical . They don't offer enough of those and the lobes are lazy.

99% of camshafts are designed on a computer with head flow specs and a bore sizing.

Nothing wrong with something that's been ran through the mathematics in the past 20 years lol.

Camshafts aren't that bigger secret. Opening and closing of intake valve brings the biggest difference.

If you think a couple degrees here or the name on the cam makes a huge difference that's on you.

As someone who used to get all there's ground locally to my spec , advance them retard them and play with them. They're ain't that bigger difference.

I've found you need 6 degrees at .050 to feel a difference over just retarding or advancing the same stick.

.020"+ lift difference is needed for a seat of the pants.

I highly doubt crow has actually dynoed many of their camshafts and not just mathematically plotted them.

I like the centre 2 for banana manifolds. The crows larger intake split of the 4502 and 4503 is to combat the intake manifold runner length to give it a bit more puff on the second wind at 6.

I'd honestly throw something that makes max hp at 5500 and changing at 5800.

With a 3.7 or slightly steeper gear I find that'd all you want with a banana manifold.

I've been looking at the 227/233 for mine before engineering. But I'm half tempted to 4 bolt main it and put a real cam in it.

 

[Deuce]

I'd honestly throw something that makes max hp at 5500 and changing at 5800.

To add to this point, make sure the exhaust on the 304 is decent, as an average exhaust will back up and halt power somewhere up there and really cut you short.
But with a good exhaust, yes, good advice to work off.

 

[harrop.senator]

To add to this point, make sure the exhaust on the 304 is decent, as an average exhaust will back up and halt power somewhere up there and really cut you short.
But with a good exhaust, yes, good advice to work off.

Definitely I like the 1 3/4 primary dpe/Manta 4-1 the most. I can't tell you if it's the sound or the pile of snakes look but I've ran them and the pacemakers.

Never had a re tune when they were on my 355 but the butt dyno felt a difference.

I've always ran twin cat and twin exhaust as well. I still haven't found a single 3" that sounded as good or hate the response of a h pipe twin.

 

[EYY]

Kelford doesn't list off the shelf grinds for any 304 only ls and straight six Holden.

Camtech hasn't been open in over a year and are permanently closed.

Clive's been running camshaft software to plot the cams for at least 5-10 years since my mate Rob was a machinist there. Or they'd literally take profiles from others that were similar to what it seems you'd want. Grind the advance in to them so the valve opening point is correct.

Also agree on Crane cams aren't that great for a 304 , they should be running split patterns and not symmetrical . They don't offer enough of those and the lobes are lazy.

99% of camshafts are designed on a computer with head flow specs and a bore sizing.

Nothing wrong with something that's been ran through the mathematics in the past 20 years lol.

Camshafts aren't that bigger secret. Opening and closing of intake valve brings the biggest difference.

If you think a couple degrees here or the name on the cam makes a huge difference that's on you.

As someone who used to get all there's ground locally to my spec , advance them retard them and play with them. They're ain't that bigger difference.

I've found you need 6 degrees at .050 to feel a difference over just retarding or advancing the same stick.

.020"+ lift difference is needed for a seat of the pants.

I highly doubt crow has actually dynoed many of their camshafts and not just mathematically plotted them.

I like the centre 2 for banana manifolds. The crows larger intake split of the 4502 and 4503 is to combat the intake manifold runner length to give it a bit more puff on the second wind at 6.

I'd honestly throw something that makes max hp at 5500 and changing at 5800.

With a 3.7 or slightly steeper gear I find that'd all you want with a banana manifold.

I've been looking at the 227/233 for mine before engineering. But I'm half tempted to 4 bolt main it and put a real cam in it.

Not sure what your point is - I was talking in past tense for a reason. Wade cams have been closed for years too, and but Clive still does their grinds. Of course they’re going to use computer simulations, you’d be mad if you didn’t.

There’s no right or wrong with cam choice, it’s all dependent on the combo and what the owner wants out of the vehicle. Using a local company that has extensive experience with the make of engine/vehicle makes the selection process a whole lot easier, and after sales support is more readily available from local manufacturers.

 

[Immortality]

Kelford have removed 304 cams from their website I suspect due to supply issues (they were also getting very pricy at NZ$525+gst last time I looked and they had listings). Franklin Cams does have stock. NZ$420+gst for a hydro FT cam. They have a basic catalogue and will also do custom grinds.

 

[gtrboyy]

crane cams basically chev grindsa from 80's.

camtech had good grinds & actually took in feedback from engine builders still messing with holden v8 but as we all know they shut down

 

[harrop.senator]

Not sure what your point is - I was talking in past tense for a reason. Wade cams have been closed for years too, and but Clive still does their grinds. Of course they’re going to use computer simulations, you’d be mad if you didn’t.

My point was you were going on about r and d and locally manafacturers for locally manafacturered motors.

As you said they're all using computer simulation, you'd be silly not to.

And then stated a heap of manafacturered that either no longer exist or don't really do 304 cams often.

It's not like crow has had every one of there cams installed and dynoed or they'd give rough HP figures and what they'd used to get there.

If crow has released any new flat tappet cams since 2000 for a 304 I'll buy you a beer lol.

And for after sales and support? There's 4 different install heights on my l67 heads running 150# crow springs and all freshly milled bases.

Want to know what there response was?

Well it seems you know how to set them up properly and they've all reached the 150# you'd asked for after being shimmed. What else do you want?

The op can go for what they want but reccomending half shut down cam suppliers and cracking on about the r and d they spent being an Australian company and an Australian motor and going for the old tried and trued method just doesn't make sense.

Look at the differences between .006 durations and .050" durations and tell me they're not a more agressive lobe profile. Which means they wont hang in the low-medium lift as long and hit peak quicker. They also out lift the others in peak and 304 heads still flow up to .600 and it leaves them in the fat part of the .400s longer.

They've also got a good exhaust split and you're not trying to cheat a manifold to rev that's not designed to rev. Add a decent manifold later and retard the cam 2-4 degrees and it'll push to 6500 if it was peaking at 5500 with the bananas.

And they're ground on a tighter lobe seperation angle which will give him the lumpy idle he wants and make the torque hit faster and narrower which is what you want with the banana manifold.

But hey maybe the Australian computers of the 90's are better for Australian motors of the 90's. Those 2010's American computers might get confused with 90's Australian motors.

 

[Immortality]

LOL, you better go buy some beers, Crow have released roller cam grinds for the 304 engines. Crane did too. But even some of those look a bit tame, I'm sure they are ground with valve train life in mind.

Crow cams are very tame for the most part but I was under the impression they have the Camtech catalogue now which were arguably the best 304 grinds available in AU unless going custom.