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VR Senator with LSx454

Discussion in 'VR - VS' started by VRSenator065, Apr 8, 2013.

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  1. corhijasna

    corhijasna Member

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    one word or maybe two

    BLO..DY AWESOME

    love the quality of your work
     
  2. VRSenator065

    VRSenator065 Now in stealth mode

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    Bit more done this week end. Nothing photo worthy.

    Couple of jobs have been sitting in the back ground. I didn't put the trans dipstick in before dropping motor as I wasn't sure what room I would have back there with the induction etc, and the old one was pretty crappy. Went and saw the boys at Norwood autos and they kindly gave me a basically new tube and stick, I think its maybe off a later model as it was longer. So after trial fitting it in and out a few times, I cut it down using the tube cutter, and use the old shorter dipstick. I then flared it to give it a neat bell mouth. Just had to tweak the bolt hole on the mounting bracket and it was perfect. Took quite a while but glad that one is done.

    Then another one that has been bugging me is I had to block off the central dipstick hole in the block that isn't used. I really should have done it when the engine was out but to be truthful forgot. You buy a $2 small pressed metal blanking plug from Holden, but I really didn't like it, to me its an accident waiting to happen. Its just a small piece of metal and if it were to work loose and fall it would pretty much go straight into the sump, that wouldn't be pretty. So the hole is a shade under 10mm (9.90), so I cut down an M10 stainless socket head cap screw I had above the thread to make a nice pin, then turned a very slight taper on it in the lathe, used some 569 loctite sealer and then gently knocked it home, came up sweet. Much happier with it, so another one that's been concerning me knocked off.

    Frank dropped off the redone boot/spoiler today, its on, most of the lights etc are in, next week he will get the bumper to me so the car will be whole again. Also chatting to him he has an auto elect. starting with him using a corner of his new workshop who according to Frank does nice work. Going to speak to him about finishing the ECU & wiring, I would be much happier knowing its in Franks workshop under his eyes.

    Just need to get onto Di Fillipo early in the week and get the bits for the exhaust happening so I can stuck into that.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2013
  3. VRSenator065

    VRSenator065 Now in stealth mode

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    Well a week end spent doing a lot of mucking around but not a huge amount to "show" for it I guess, really just wanted to get my head around what's in front of me. Unpacked it all, sorted through it all, for some reason the cats weren't included with the stuff, but will sort that tomorrow.

    Set it out on the floor, first time building a full exhaust of course but also first time I have seen a twin 3" system laid out in the flesh, man they are big! Makes a 2 1/2 look like a Pee shooter :) Should look and sound pretty sweet once its done.

    [​IMG]

    So spent yesterday cutting up small rings of tube and playing trying to tig weld them together. First impressions, harder than it looks but I seemed to get better pretty quickly. Actually having no trouble welding, just getting way too much penetration. Hopefully during the week will get the chance to see my mate and get a few pointers. Tacking looks pretty bloody simple, so worse case I will build it all tacked then get him to finish it off, wait and see. This is me playing around.

    [​IMG]

    Did get the front passenger side cut off, so I can make up the two 2" to 3" collectors. A tip if anyone is tempted to buy one of these expander tools, forget it. They might be alright for fixing an out of round pipe but no way are they good enough to expand even the 2" mild steel let alone 3" stainless. Have cut the tubes and reckon I will just go to a muffler place and get them to expand the two ends for me.

    [​IMG]

    This is what not to buy.
    [​IMG]

    Also had a look at the rear twin 3". It is reasonably tight, but I think if I just massage the vertical steel edge of the spare well it will give it enough clearance. Might see about finding some stick on heat stuff just for the side of the tank.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  4. corhijasna

    corhijasna Member

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    very very very very very nice,looooooooooooooking awesome,the exhaust is very close isn't it-lol

    bound to have little teething problems

    looks bloody awesome though,congrats on your workmanship,is bloody awesome too

    you'll have to come for a cruise to the bridge when you get done so I can see her in the flesh (hoping) lol
     
  5. Vs hsv manta

    Vs hsv manta Member

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    Yeah I have just finished building my first twin 3 inch my self and yes it does look a heap bigger then a twin 2 1/2 inch system

    I put some pics up on this sit on my thread

    Do u have a foot pedal for your tig ???

    The one I'm using (allmax 200p ac/dc tig) does and with out it, burn holes constently, but with it u can play on the one spot all day long and not burn a hole

    Are u making your own x pipe ??? If so do u have any pacific amour your cutting out the side of the 2 90degree bend ???
     
  6. Deuce

    Deuce Super Stock

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    Yeah, I also just built twin 2.5" to single 3" and the pipe size definitely jumps up a notch or three. I would expect you will have some head scratching to get a full length twin 3" to fit up snug and not touch.
    Good Luck (and have fun tig-ing, great skill to learn)
     
  7. peteVX6L

    peteVX6L Donating Member

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    REALLY liking this build thread. (insert shocked face)
    This guy Frank you speak of? Wow, wish he lived in NZ. It must be good knowing you have his eyes on it.
    The detail and specs here make me drool. i wasn't into VR's till about half an hour ago.
    Looking forward to updates.
    Love your work, awesome stuff.
     
  8. Not_An_Abba_Fan

    Not_An_Abba_Fan Exhaust Guru

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    My advice would be NOT to kiss the pipes at the front but rather flip the 45's going into the mufflers and join them with straight pipe onto the front 45's, then fit a 2" H pipe just where the two pipes start to go parallel. Will flow better and sound nicer.
     
  9. VRSenator065

    VRSenator065 Now in stealth mode

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    Hi naaf, thanks for that. It really seems the "best" way to do a merge/kiss/X /H pipe is one of those very controversial/personal things that everyone has "their way" I chatted at length to Darren Di Phillipo, and in no way whatsoever am I doubting you or your knowledge but in his opinion an H pipe effects flow and performance and according to him he has tested it on a dyno. In the end I have decided to go as planned above but again its a very line ball decision, which you may well be right on. Time will tell, and will of course post up once the thing is running on what it sounds and goes like :)
     
  10. Not_An_Abba_Fan

    Not_An_Abba_Fan Exhaust Guru

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    It really depends on where you want your torque to peak. Lower in the revs, use the kiss pipe, higher up, then go with the H.

    The H in itself doesn't affect flow as such, all it does is balance the pulses through the exhaust as the firing order is not sequential. The kiss type combines the pulses from side to side and will aid in scavenging in the lower rpm range. As the revs get up though, the pulses will actually interfere with each other and create back pressure.

    I have done this with our own LS1, the best position for a proper X pipe is actually back where the mufflers are. As the exhaust cools it takes up less space and loses velocity, when it goes through the X pipe, it speeds up again and pulls the next pulse from the opposite side along with it. Too close to the engine and the pulses are too close together when the RPM increases and each pulse will clip the preceding pulse and actually slow it down. I fitted an X pipe right behind the cats on our Senator and it slowed it down, had great acceleration off the mark and up to around 4000rpm, then it felt like you took your foot off a bit. I removed the mufflers and fitted it back there and it then pulled hard all the way to the limiter.

    There are people on both sides of the fence and in the correct application, both an X and a H will work, it just depends on the application.
     
  11. VRSenator065

    VRSenator065 Now in stealth mode

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    Bloody excellent explanation right there, I really like to try and understand the why not just "do it". For now I think the primaries really are too small anyway for maximum power at high rpm. So maybe I will go with the kiss, but once I have got bored and start chasing hp, the engine is coming out, and a nice set of custom 2" primary headers are going in amongst a few other things, but that will be a long way off. Sounds like that will be the time to experiment with the H pipe. Much appreciated.
     
  12. Not_An_Abba_Fan

    Not_An_Abba_Fan Exhaust Guru

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    At the end of the day, if it's a street car, the only real difference the H and the kiss/X will make is to the note it produces.

    Header size isn't that important either, it is if you are tuning to a specific RPM, but otherwise, what you have will be fine.
     
  13. immortality

    immortality Can't live without smoky bacon! Staff Member

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    Fixed it for you :)
     
  14. VRSenator065

    VRSenator065 Now in stealth mode

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    OK is this one of those saying us old farts don't get and the kids laugh when I ask what that means? :)
     
  15. immortality

    immortality Can't live without smoky bacon! Staff Member

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    No secret meaning mate (not that this semi-old fart knows off anyway).

    More often it's used when someone makes a comment and we correct it for them as we may believe that our correction is more accurate. It's generally a "tongue in cheek" type of thing.
     
  16. immortality

    immortality Can't live without smoky bacon! Staff Member

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    No secret meaning mate (not that this semi-old fart knows off anyway).

    More often it's used when someone makes a comment and we correct it for them as we may believe that our correction is more accurate. It's generally a "tongue in cheek" type of thing.
     
  17. VRSenator065

    VRSenator065 Now in stealth mode

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    Thanks for that, thought it might have been some young secret squirrel thing!!
     
  18. ephect

    ephect Donating Member

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    How's the exhaust building coming along?
     
  19. VRSenator065

    VRSenator065 Now in stealth mode

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    Yea good, have all the gear now, picked up some 10mm stainless rod for the muffler hangers, the cats have arrived, also some heat proof sheet I am going to fit between the rear muffler and tank. Got the two 2" pipes for the new collector end expanded at a local exhaust place, so that ready to go. Took my new tig down to a mates yesterday after work and he gave me a bit of a lesson and set it up for me. Actually once I sort of understood it I was pretty happy how my welding was going. I had the current way too high, its nothing really like mig (anyone who can tig reading this will be laughing now), its so much like oxy but more "delicate" and precise. So going to hopefully get into it on the week end, not sure how slow/fast it will come together. Plan is to cut and tack it all first.
     
  20. corhijasna

    corhijasna Member

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    take your time and it will come along real nice, just like the rest of your work has been

    love your quality of workmanship-haven't seen many better-imo
     
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