vs v8 sedan with abs

[phear11]

hi does anyone have a vs 5l auto sedan in the southern suburbs (im in reynella) with abs?

ive been having alot of issues with my vs berlinas brakes and just wanted to compare mine to someone elses to see if mine are really crap or its all vs 5l autos.

so let me know if u have one that i can look at and talk to u about. cheers jamie

 

[VRSenator065]

All VR/VS standard OE brakes are crap, almost dangerous. There are lots of good VE upgrade kits around at pretty reasonable prices and its a pretty straight forward swap.

 

[jgtoranalc]

VR TO VS Commodore BIG Brake Upgrade KIT VE V8 322mm Rotor | eBay

But I have been told that the Brake fluid given in the ebay ad is wrong for your ABS in the VR-VS models.... but Dot 4 or Dot 5.1 is ok....not Dot 5

 

[phear11]

yeah i just want to compare to someone elses before i go and upgrade anything.
as ive driven a v6 vs and the brakes were awesome, obviously having the extra weight of the v8 is going to slow it down but the v8's have a 1" master cylinder and the v6 a 7/16 or something so that should counteract it and they should be simmilar but mine are exeptionally **** untill i pump the brake pedal a few times and have replaced alot on this car already. so mainly looking to compare how crap mine are to see if its just usual shittty commo brakes or mine.
cheers

 

[someguy360]

All VR/VS standard OE brakes are crap, almost dangerous.

Agreed, my big heavy statesman travels a downhill 110km/h freeway which puts the fear of god in me and keeps me on my toes in the rain like we have been having lately.

 

[VRSenator065]

yeah i just want to compare to someone elses before i go and upgrade anything.
as ive driven a v6 vs and the brakes were awesome, obviously having the extra weight of the v8 is going to slow it down but the v8's have a 1" master cylinder and the v6 a 7/16 or something so that should counteract it and they should be simmilar but mine are exeptionally **** untill i pump the brake pedal a few times and have replaced alot on this car already. so mainly looking to compare how crap mine are to see if its just usual shittty commo brakes or mine.
cheers

Master cylinder size doesn't really have much to do with braking power, more brake pedal feel. The brakes themselves, ie disc and calipers are what do the work. Even my senator didn't have a 1" cylinder. There is a reason there are so many upgrade kits available. But drive one and see what you think.

 

[BlackVXGTS]

From the Holden Commodore VS Service Manual:

"To improve the feel of the brakes, there have been some major changes to the brake system on VS Series Models as compared to VR Series Models. The most notable of these changes includes; a new master cylinder and brake booster, both of which are common to standard and ABS brakes. Also a new brake pedal was introduced in late production for VR Series Models which changed the pedal ratio from 4.9:1 to 4.3:1.

Unlike VR Series Models, a common master cylinder with a 7/8" diameter bore is used on vehicles with standard and ABS brakes. The only difference being that the master cylinder used with ABS has a screw in blanking plug installed and tightened into the lower of the two front brake outlets in the master cylinder. The only other difference in master cylinders between VS Series Models is that the Utility Model does not have a proportioning valve incorporated into the master cylinder design.

The master cylinder is a centre valve type master cylinder of a different design to previous models and incorporates a fast fill valve which provides reduced pedal travel.
The tandem master cylinder is mounted to the vacuum brake booster which in turn, is mounted to the engine side of the dash panel."

 

[Jxfwsf]

start with the basics.

What brand pads are you running?
Have they suffered a lot of hard braking and possibly glazed over?
When was the last time the fluid was flushed and changed?

Old fluid that is only topped up and never changed will probably be mostly water, a simple test is to get a glass of water and a DMM, set the multi meter onto resistance, dump the probes in the water 1-2 cm's apart, adjust the multimeter until you get a reading (X Mohms)
Put the probes in the MC submersed in the brake fluid at the same distance, take note of the reading (if it's close to the glass of water then it needs changing)
If you have a b/new bottle of unopened brake fluid, crack it open and poor some in the cap, do the same and take note of the reading (it will probably show some reading but it's a baseline of what you should be getting when doing the same into the MC res)

And that's pretty much what all the expensive brake fluid testers with pretty leds do.....

for the s&g's i recently ran a set of cheap calibre front pads in a vn v6, apart from only lasting 30,000 km's they had better braking and pedal feel than alot of VN-VS 6 & 8's that i have driven lately....

 

[phear11]

bendix hd in the rear and bendix general ct in the front. will prob be putting bendix hd in the front this week to see if it makes any difference.
replaced the rotors. all new 2 years ago and still in good cond with no glazing.
blead the brakes alot of times (has probably had close to 10 bottles flushed thru in the last 24 months, and as recent as a week ago when i put new seals thru all 4 calipers.

changed the abs module as it was not working and master cylinder with s/h ones which made no difference.
added an extra brand new 1 way valve for the booster incase the origional one was stuffed.
nothing has made a difference from when i bought the car. brakes are still crap, that crap it has to be wet and i have to jump hard on the brakes to get abs or lockup slightly (its that quick its hard to know if its lockup or abs) and just slows down very slowly.

the only time the brakes work awesome is when i first drive them when its been wet then after 2 or 3 applications they go back to crap.
or if i push the pedal a few times when i want to stop they work pretty well. just wish it was all the time not sometimes cos when u really need to stop quick u dont have time to pump the pedal.
ive had abs (the brake specialists not) check everything and they said theres nothing wrong at all but dont believe them as i got another mechanic to look and thats when they said the abs module was ###d so got another sh one and it made no difference.

im just sick of wasting time and money for no difference.
any ideas?
the only other thing i was thinking was try another booster which ive done the test that u pump the pedal with car off keep foot on and start car and it drops so should be ok.
the pedal is just always spongy.

 

[BlackVXGTS]

You will never be happy with the standard brakes. I replaced the front brakes in both my 383 VS Calais and VS Clubsport with AP Racing four piston calipers, 330ml DBA rotors, braided lines, about 16 years ago and they have been magnificent (but they were expensive). The eBay VE upgrade mentioned by jgtoranalc in his post seems like excellent value for money.