Water leaking into VE Commodore - 4 Fixes

[Fu Manchu]

Every car in the world is like that.
The stuff is butyl.
Car builders sell it.

 

[J_D 2.0]

I think there will be a lot more VE owners plugging up their leaks after this. I've been chasing the train for at rear carpet recently too. Pulled off all the bottom for seafood and cleaned them, and removed drivers door skin to check how much dirt was in the bottom and cleaned it out with a paint brush. What's a good product to use to re seal the plastic lining? Seems kinda strange that the door innards would be designed to direct the water to run down the inside face of the doors? That will always lead to leaks at some stage. Surely some wise old elf in the design team would design team would make sure there was a deflector or something inside the door that keeps train taking towards the outside door skin? An I the only one that thinks that way.?

It’s a stupid design to be sure. I’ve had plenty of cars in the past that had no door card plastic at all and never had a problem with water leaking in. My SSV was full of water just from having the bottom of the plastic unsealed for about a foot or so. When you hose the outside of the door tonnes of water pours up against the plastic.

You need Sikaflex 227 to reseal it. You can get it from the automotive stores (Repco etc) or Bunnings. I got mine from Bunnings as Repco had run out of stock at the time.

Make doubly sure you’ve got it entirely sealed otherwise you’ll have to pull it all off again as I had to for my passenger front door. Missed a small spot maybe 5mm long and it still poured in until I resealed it.

https://aus.sika.com/en/36913/automotive-aftermarket/panel-bonding/sealants/sikaflex-227.html

 

[J_D 2.0]

I think there will be a lot more VE owners plugging up their leaks after this. I've been chasing the train for at rear carpet recently too. Pulled off all the bottom for seafood and cleaned them, and removed drivers door skin to check how much dirt was in the bottom and cleaned it out with a paint brush. What's a good product to use to re seal the plastic lining? Seems kinda strange that the door innards would be designed to direct the water to run down the inside face of the doors? That will always lead to leaks at some stage. Surely some wise old elf in the design team would design team would make sure there was a deflector or something inside the door that keeps train taking towards the outside door skin? An I the only one that thinks that way.?

Also if you’ve got water in your rear carpet check your front door cards! My rear carpet was soaked and the front carpet was mostly fine. My rear doors weren’t leaking it all, it was from both the front doors.

If your car is parked even slightly nose up (as mine is when it’s in the driveway) all the water will run down the side channels under the carpet where the wiring looms go to puddle at the back of the car.

 

[greenacc]

Also if you’ve got water in your rear carpet check your front door cards! My rear carpet was soaked and the front carpet was mostly fine. My rear doors weren’t leaking it all, it was from both the front doors.

If your car is parked even slightly nose up (as mine is when it’s in the driveway) all the water will run down the side channels under the carpet where the wiring looms go to puddle at the back of the car.

Same here, always parked nose up. The biggest problem I've got with that is it's impossible to check the oil level at home!
You don't think normal construction Sika would seal it, it works well in bathrooms

 

[Fu Manchu]

The Sika 227 is a curing sealant. You can use it but only once. The idea of the butyl used on most cars is the plastic can be removed and easily resealed for servicing components without tearing the plastic weather sheet.

If the 227 or even a silicone is used, the weather sheet tears. You also then have to reseal, but you’ll have sealant everywhere. That needs removing otherwise you get a build up of it.

The amount of times I’ve done work inside a car door and then needed to go back in to make an adjustment is a lot. With a wet curing sealant, that’s going to go everywhere when the weather sheet is pulled back again potentially getting all over you, our clothes, the window tint, interior panels.

As I have mentioned, weather sheets are on just about every car. High end as well. (Have seen them on stereo videos on BMWs and a Ferrari) This recently uploaded one by a talented detailer shows the weather sheet in his BMW at @9:30

Ones I have worked on, My old Suburus, Toyotas, every Commodore I’ve worked on has had them. Mazdas have them. Hyundais have them. Hondas too.

Usually the problem is people and mechanics impulsively peeling them back, ripping them, cutting them to get to a door lock, not using general care and putting them back on damaged (or not at all). Then water gets in.

The Car Builders Door Restore kit:
https://www.carbuilders.com.au/door-restore-kit

Best bit is a thicker more durable plastic is used.

If someone wants reuse the plastic, or use some of their own more robust plastic then the butyl strip is easily sourced:
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/3739580...VTSobbORpi&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

 

[Fu Manchu]

When new the door seals on the VE and VF were pretty good. They have the double seal along the exterior of the window.
As the cars age the primary seal on the glass has pretty much deteriorated away on just about every VE I’ve seen. That leaves only one seal against the glass lower down. Door seals will be hardening now. They aren’t as soft as previous models.

Using silicone paste into the door seals keeps them fuller and softer. This is recommended by a number of manufactures in the northern hemisphere.

•Replacing the exterior window seals ($600-$800 for a set on models with the chrome!) is a big step forward. Problem is in time to come, the same thing will happen.

•Door seals will be the next thing to care for. Rub silicone paste into them every year. Let it soak in over night. I also apply aerospace 303 to them to stop them deteriorating. (I don’t know why silicone paste works but silicone based liquid dressings make the soft plastics and seals harden.)

•Get the trims off the doors and redo the weather sheet.

 

[greenacc]

The Sika 227 is a curing sealant. You can use it but only once. The idea of the butyl used on most cars is the plastic can be removed and easily resealed for servicing components without tearing the plastic weather sheet.

If the 227 or even a silicone is used, the weather sheet tears. You also then have to reseal, but you’ll have sealant everywhere. That needs removing otherwise you get a build up of it.

The amount of times I’ve done work inside a car door and then needed to go back in to make an adjustment is a lot. With a wet curing sealant, that’s going to go everywhere when the weather sheet is pulled back again potentially getting all over you, our clothes, the window tint, interior panels.

As I have mentioned, weather sheets are on just about every car. High end as well. (Have seen them on stereo videos on BMWs and a Ferrari)
Ones I have worked on, My old Suburus, Toyotas, every Commodore I’ve worked on has had them. Mazdas have them. Hyundais have them. Hondas too.

Usually the problem is people and mechanics impulsively peeling them back, ripping them, cutting them to get to a door lock, not using general care and putting them back on damaged (or not at all). Then water gets in.

The Car Builders Door Restore kit:
https://www.carbuilders.com.au/door-restore-kit

Best bit is a thicker more durable plastic is used.

If someone wants reuse the plastic, or use some of their own more robust plastic then the butyl strip is easily sourced:
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/3739580...VTSobbORpi&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

Ooh the Butyl tape looks like good stuff. For a second I couldn't seem to find the length of tape in each pack. Thinking why don't 4M label their blasted adds properly, and since when did 3M aquire the 4th?
Since removing all the bottom four seals seafood and scrubbing all the mud and dirty $#!T out of them with a toothbrush the leakage has reduced a lot. Also cleaned the drain holes. But after removing the drivers door card to have a peek inside and seeing the dirt on the bottom I think the cleaning out all the doors all is the proper thing to do next. That will no doubt help the doors last longer by avoiding RUST caused by wet mud sitting in the bottom crease as well. Maybe worth spraying some fish oil or Inox or something in there at the same time. Then sealing them up again with the Butyl tape, and hopefully only need to pull apart each door once .
At one point during the recent floods I was keeping a pack of microfiber towels on rear passenger floor. Every time I walked past the car I would grab the towels, roll them up and wring out about a litre of water, sometimes 6 or seven times. Then lie them flat on the carpet again to soak up the next liter of water from the next torrential downpour. Kids said my car smelled like a fish tank A wet vacuum works well too.

 

[Skylarking]

It’s a stupid design to be sure. I’ve had plenty of cars in the past that had no door card plastic at all and never had a problem with water leaking in.

Yes fully agree and manufacturers should hold their heads in shame

Unfortunately modern manufacturers see planned obsolescence as progress… it progresses the sale of new cars as the old ones start having annoying problems and owners get fed up and oddly jump back on then treadmill

 

[J_D 2.0]

Ones I have worked on, My old Suburus, Toyotas, every Commodore I’ve worked on has had them. Mazdas have them. Hyundais have them. Hondas too.

Yes every car has them but the VE seems to piss tonnes of water up against the plastic sheeting for some reason.

Every other car I’ve owned the plastic sheeting being torn or removed is a minor inconvenience when a few drops of water get in, on the VE it’s a disaster as it pours in.

Old weather strips aren’t to blame either as I replaced the weather strips on my SSV only 12 months ago.

 

[Fu Manchu]

The other place can be from the seals around the door handles.