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WH Statesman 3.8 Lts starts rough for the fist 2 seconds

Discussion in 'VT - VX Holden Commodore (1997 - 2002)' started by VFSV6FORME, Apr 24, 2019.

  1. VFSV6FORME

    VFSV6FORME Well-Known Member

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    Yes My son car that he purchased without my permission at a Shonky Car yard here that sell cars on FACEACHE In Qld Caboolture. Yes He purchased this car with Plenty of faults for $2500 but knows SWEET F/ALL about cars and he is relying on me to fix it. GRUUUUUUUH!!!
    I'm slowly fixing the car so after I get the second hand drivers Side Rear Door Actuator/mechanism from ebay and fix the clips issue with the Rods I will start fixing other issue. so far I have replace the Boot lock + Fixed the actuator to open electrically the boot + the Emergency boot release behind the back seat+ today I got the two new struts so the boot doesn't invert itself by slamming shut. Yes he had a waist belt to stop the boot flying up and down whist anyone that drove it FFsake. Trying to fix this car only when My son comes over so he learns about car stuff and at the same time I spend time to fix my smashed Cheap VE.

    Now for the Issue

    Now when you start this WH Statesman which is a 3.8 lts for the first time in a colder morning for a few seconds it starts very rough like if it starts with too low RPM. Now I know that all modern cars have the bypass Stepper motor that controls the bypass air around the throttle body that allows more air in around the closed throttle body when cold (forgot what they call this).
    Now when it starts and the revs after a few seconds of rough trying to stall the engine go up to 1050 RPM when cold then it slowly goes back to normal after a minute or so it stabilizing and during the day when it starts after 2 or 3 hours its ok.
    I get the feeling that the stepper motor is not adjusting correctly when you turn the ignition on and the ECU sees that the car is cold but does not adjust accordingly so what do you think can be the issue beside a water temp sensor as the gauge is working OK.
    thanks
     
  2. krusing

    krusing Active Member

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    First I would clean the Throttle Body, that includes the IAC Valve [Idle Air Control Valve]
    Then check the Plugs and leads,
    make sure you dont have Christmas Tree under the bonnet
    [needs to be done in a very dark place, so you can see the any sparks leaking from the leads, and be careful of the fingers in the engine bay in the dark]

    After that, see how it goes,
    If still no good, that's when it becomes process of elimination.
    Also best to purchase a Manual for it, if its that bad,
    so he can learn what the parts are, and where they are located.
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2019
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  3. VFSV6FORME

    VFSV6FORME Well-Known Member

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    I pulled the IAC Valve (found what it was called) out as it was easy to get at and it was stuffed as it did want to go back to the stepper motor itself that would allow more air in.
    Anyhow 83 dollars at ebay will fix that and if it does not fix it my son will have to put up with the poor starting in the morning for the first time. I will let my son to buy it as I have using my money to fix the car so far.

    I will test the car at Night to see if the leads glow at Night. Thanks for the tip
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2019
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  4. VFSV6FORME

    VFSV6FORME Well-Known Member

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    Check it in total dark and nothing lit up. So its good in that area. Yes after I played with the Idle Air Control Valve its a lot worse now so I will have to get another one as soon as my Son cough up the $$$
     
  5. NeddyBear

    NeddyBear Veteran Mountain Biker

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    How many ks has the Statesman done and as for correcting issues where does one start.
    5 years ago our Acclaim started running rough and we replaced the Idle Control Valve, maybe 40 dollars from Repco and she's been running smooth ever since. I'd also check and replace all the electrical things or maybe scrap the entire car and have him buy something much newer.
     
  6. VFSV6FORME

    VFSV6FORME Well-Known Member

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    The car has done 240,000 K
    Yes I will eventually buy the ICV becuse my Son cant even afford to pay for the Rego. He is unemployed at the Moment and been like this for 8 years. I bet he curse his life as I had WARS with his mother to a point of divorce all because when my son was 11 to 18 years old all he did is PLAY PLAYSTATION!!!!. The Playstation has ruined him big time. SAD he has NEVER EVER listen to me on Nothing Now he is paying for his mistakes. I was a Licensed Electrician and Studied to be a Engineers that loved Cars. When he was Young I would say come out with me and work on the Cars (had plenty of Choices), Or come outside and watch and Work as I was putting up a 4M Satellite Dish which I have a few of different sizes, He Complain to his Mother as he does not not want to see how cars work or how a satellite dish works, all he want to do is go play with that Playstation and his mother protected with this issue. I even barred his ip address, mac address and other to stop him getting on 12 hours a day.
    In the older days fathers had control of their kids mainly the Son but this days with the **** is going on now you can tell your kids what to do.
    My RANT Finished.

    Sad
     
  7. VFSV6FORME

    VFSV6FORME Well-Known Member

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    Yes that what I told him as he purchased this car from a SHARK on Facebook with plenty of faults. It has at least 20 faults and the main one is THE AIRBAG light is on but yet he got a RWC when he got the car.
    Dont worry as My son is Very Good but does not think AT ALL and his Girlfriend runs ring around him (100 Times Smarter)as to a point we had to talk to a Solicitor because we dont trust her (wife hate her as she is very Violent) as she had a baby with my son and she is looking at what we own and wont get nothing when we die.

    My son is Autistic (Asperger) and this is the only reason why he cant get a Job. He was Born like this and he will die like this and the whole population will use him including his Girlfriend that has $$$$$$ in her eyes when we both Die
    second RANT Finished
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2019
  8. commodore665

    commodore665 expat Saffa

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    might I suggest that if your son is come into money when you and your wife pass away , that you put in a trust fund , and he is given an allowance to live on weekly or whatever , also I'd be tempted to talk to the seller for taking advantage of your son .
     
  9. VFSV6FORME

    VFSV6FORME Well-Known Member

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    The Person that sold this car to my son is missing. Well the next thing that we will do is book for a appointment to the solicitor that specializes in these matters. It should not have to come to this but we all know what Power Women have over men today. She smart but the People that I spoke too is smarter and they have told me they have run into women like her before.
     
  10. losh1971

    losh1971 Well-Known Member

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    I had a rough start a few weeks ago, like yours only first start for the day. Turns out the battery was lowish on charge. Charged it up with the battery charger and it has been fine ever since. People on here had various theories but it was just a simple thing.
     
  11. VFSV6FORME

    VFSV6FORME Well-Known Member

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    Back to my sons WH Stateman

    I change the Air Idle Valve todayt but its still the same when COLD. Now two weeks ago I removed the Old Idle Control Valve from the car, the Car was COLD in the morning, I plug the wiring harness again, I give the Idle control Valve to my wife to hold onto it (remember its connected to the Car and the car is COLD) Now I turned the ignition on and it wound OUT with power and the center bit with the spring fell on the Ground.
    Now Consider the day before the car was normal operation Temperature and when I turned the car off the idle control valve should have stayed in the same position being more closed to limit the RPM (say 650 RPM) but the next day when I remover the Idle Control Valve for testing and gave it to my wife to hold it and when I turned the Initiation ON you would think the Idle Control valve would be WOUND IN to allow more air in NOT THE OTHER way to be wound out.
    Now this make no sense so what else can be causing this issue of a Control Valve is winding out when Cold and shutting the bypass hole off.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2019
  12. VFSV6FORME

    VFSV6FORME Well-Known Member

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    Interesting!!!! but when the car starts the Voltage is up you would think the Alternator would take over. Anyhow tomorrow is another day and will be a Cold morning so I will tell you all whats happening.
     
  13. losh1971

    losh1971 Well-Known Member

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    Mine run rough for 3 or 4 seconds. It then went fine. I was told it probably wasn't the battery as the alt kicks in once the engine fires. Turns out some really knowledgeable members weren't right. I was told lifter bleed among other things. Told it's a normal thing, but nup.
     
  14. VFSV6FORME

    VFSV6FORME Well-Known Member

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    What do you think the issue is?
     
  15. losh1971

    losh1971 Well-Known Member

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    In your case I aint sure but try charging the battery overnight and see if it helps. All I'm saying is that fixed the issue with my rough few second start. It may or may not help but it won't cost you anything, if you own a charger.
     
  16. VFSV6FORME

    VFSV6FORME Well-Known Member

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    Yes I have two good ones. I charge it tomorrow, to cold outside now for me
     
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  17. losh1971

    losh1971 Well-Known Member

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    Cool, might as well give it a try, nothing to lose.
     
  18. VFSV6FORME

    VFSV6FORME Well-Known Member

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    Forgot to charge the battery today but I will do it tomorrow. I started it this morning and it stalled straight away. I started it again and it stalled 5 seconds later. I started it for the 3rd time and it did the same. I started it for the 4th time again, but this time I gave the accelerator pedal a bit of help and it was fine, it started OK idled about 1200 RPM because my foot was on the accelerator and after 20 seconds I took my foot off. Another thing I noticed it hunts a little bit, goes from 800 to 1100 RPM, it does this a few times, then it stabilises. It only happens when you start it on cold mornings.
     
  19. accentstencil

    accentstencil Well-Known Member

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    It could be a faulty Throttle Position Sensor.
     
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  20. VFSV6FORME

    VFSV6FORME Well-Known Member

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    Yes I play with that 3 days ago. Does another know how they test them? I remember in the 1993 VR Days I changed mine as it was faulty and had to set it at around 25 Ohms when the throttle was fully closed but I know F... all above the later cars like the WH Statesman and if it just a on/off micro switch or other.
     

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