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To LPG or not to LPG

VT2VEight

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Hey guys,

I want some recommendations as to whether I sould gas my GenIII. As everyone's aware, the price for fuel is unbelievable. I used to have a VS 6 and it hated LPG, infact I had to redo the cylinders 3 times in the 4 years I had it. So in particular I ask anyone who does have a GenIII on gas to spill the beans on wheteher you've had any mechanical issues and if the performance suffers as a result.

Thanks :)
 

michaelw

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I am not running gas (I don't even own a V8) but I doubt that petrol is EVER going to get cheaper. I would get the gas and save the petrol for "playtime".

Mike
 

brad_m_is

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Not Lpg!!!

Hey

I would never recommend LPG to any one due to my bad experiences with it. Id rather walk than have it on my car.
but in saying that, there is probly alot of people out there that have had no problems with it.
Thats my opinion anyway its something u would have to decide urself really!

Cheers
 

Gravy

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I bought a VT on factory gas about 5 months back. Its a standard V6 not an V8. Performance is still quite good although this is my first commodore so dont have much to compare to (previous was an '89 TX5 2.2 turbo). Factory gas systems are dual fuel so you can always flick over to petrol if you want a few extra HP.

Any misfire problems due to bad leads or plugs can result in backfires back through the airbox, sometimes powerful enough to destroy the airbox and a few sensors. Newer airboxes are ribbed for strength and tend to pop open easier when a backfire occurs but can still rip apart with a big backfire. LPG backfires sound nothing like your regular "through the exhaust" backfire, they simply sound like a dull pop rather than a bang, if you have ever hit a small animal like a rabbit it sounds something like that (sad face). When the car is badly tuned they will most likely occur during starting or under load. I actually tend to give the starter an extra second or so of crank after the car starts to ensure that it doesnt stall and backfire. Some people prefer to start on Petrol and then flick to LPG, I cant be bothered doing that. Its also best to keep the car well tuned.

My car actually runs worse on petrol at the moment (hesitates on takeoff), but this is likely due to dirty injectors, I cant be bothered getting them cleaned though as I run on GAS almost all the time. Its recommended to run petrol occasionally to lube the system so I hear.

The factory system is also setup so that it sucks a bit of petrol even on gas when the engine is under heavy load, this gives you a bit of extra power when needed. So its important to keep at least some petrol in the tank to prevent fuel pump damage (or so I hear).

I think my LPG tank is about 75 litres and I get around 550km of mixed driving on a full tank, gas prices here in Coffs Harbour NSW can vary by about 10c between suppliers... Ive found Woolworths+ Service station to be best value at about 44c a litre after 2c docket discount. LPG seems to stay at a fixed price rather than fluctuate based on the day of the week.

Apparantly gas efficiency is not quite as good as Petrol.... but with the price of LPG well under half that of Petrol I know what I would prefer in the current market. It is also much better for the environment as you are likely aware.

Converting your car is likely to cost you several thousand, you need to calculate how much you would save each year based on current usage, and then consider how long you will keep the vehicle. As a rough figure, assume that you will at least halve your current fuel bill. If you are intending to sell the vehicle within say 2 years and wont actually break even within that time then the answer is probably not to bother converting. However adding gas to your car is likely to increase its value somewhat, probably not by as much as it cost you though.

In my opinion, LPG vehicles are likely to sell somewhat easier to a certain market considering the current petrol prices. The guy I bought my car off had many inquiries via his Tradingpost advert and Im sure he could have sold it many times over (about 14 calls the day the ad was released, I bought it via the TP website prior to it being released in the paper), people were willing to fly up from Sydney to Coffs to check it out, not bad considering how many VT Commodores (petrol powered) are for sale at any one time.

If you do long outback trips you may benefit from the added km range due to having two tanks of fuel onboard.

The only major downside as I see it is bootspace reduction, the LPG tank takes up a lot of space and if you have a family this may be an issue, there is still room for quite a bit, pram or two small suitcases etc, but you may certainly miss the space. You will also lose the ability to put long items in through the boot and into the cabin via the folding middle rear seat. So say byebye to sticking skiis in the boot lengthways.

Hope this helps.

Cheers,

Graham
 

VT2VEight

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Checked it out

Thank you so much for the feedback, those problems you have had Graham are identical to what I used to suffer in my VS. I went to a Gas specialist and installer today, and he was very hesitant to install an LPG kit in my car. He was telling me about one of his clients that had LPG installed to his VZ one tonner GenIII a few months back. The car only had 11000 kilometres on it when it started back firing. And every time it back fired, the inlet manifold and tapper cover blew off. This happened three times and each time it cost $1500 to replace!! Apparentlly in the GenIIIs the inlet manifold is plastic unlike the ecotec which is alloy. He also smartly added that i was better off buying a ford :yeah:

As it turned out the VZ had a cam sensor problem, which caused it to back fire. He also said i'd have to be very cautious about my driving, something which I decided I didnt want to worry about everytime i wanted to plant it. It's just a hassle having to constantly worry about the fear of a backfire everytime anyone drives the car, which has really turned me off the idea of converting.

I guess I'll just have to learn to be a little less lead footed, and use public transport a bit more!!
 

brendanteck

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I have been looking at putting LPG onto my VX V6. LP gas 1 in Lilydale have a new system out that uses a second set of injectors for the LPG. Been told it cures most of the backfiring issues ( because you have a lot less gas in the inlet system ). Anybody else out there had any experiance or used this system before?

BT
 

Freddy510

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More on LPG

G'day out there!
I am researching running LPG on my work Hiace van whick is about to get a V6 Holden conversion. I have ran LPG for 16 years on my V8 Holden powered Hilux 2wd. I built the motor to suit gas (10.5:1 Comp, Msd and regraphed dizzy, straight gas no petrol). I have had zero problems, unreal performance and $20 a week to run. I also have a Ford on dual fuel, good as a family truckster, but straight gas is the go. You really need to get the ignition timing right (I run 19 deg static and 10 deg mechanical). Has anyone out there used a V6 on straight gas? Anyone done so and managed to get a chip that can have the timing modded without costing a bomb (Dizzy nice and cheap). I am not hijacking this thread, but sniffing out info that can help with this thread. I would probably use a Gas Research "throttle body" style gas carb. My theory is if it is going to be a bitch getting the V6 running right on gas, I will swap in a low tech 308 V8 which I know I can do cheaply and it will run reliably for 300,000k's or so as my other engine has.
The backfiring thing with the Gen 3 is a worry. My Ford 6 on Dual fuel does it now and then. Fit a blow off door (with a spring loaded hinge) on your airbox and you won't blow your airbox to bits! Took a couple of times before it wrecked the airbox!! Note my low tech V8 gas motor does not have the same drama. (Sorry about the lenght of the rant guys!!)
Check Ya!
Freddy
 
D

death-from-above

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Ive now owned two dual fuel cars and highly recommend them. I havn't had any dramas at all. On my old VL i had the air box blow off a few times but nothing major and just re-cliped it back on. There are many different ways to reduce the effect of backfiring, any reputable gas fitter will tell you about these, be wary if they say you have to replace the whole inlet system each time a backfire happens. An RACV guy i spoke to said there was a device that was like a sock that blew off instead of gas being forced back into the AFM and hence the airbox blowing up.

There is also different options when choosing gas, I would recommend gas injection rather than using a carby to mix the fuel. As it will produce much higher power figures and better responsiveness.

Your best bet would be to speak to Gas Research and get one of their systems, however be aware that not many gas fitters will be able to fix their systems because a lot of their gears documentation isn't available to try and reduce other companies copying their products.
 
V

VXexCOP

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brendanteck said:
I have been looking at putting LPG onto my VX V6. LP gas 1 in Lilydale have a new system out that uses a second set of injectors for the LPG. Been told it cures most of the backfiring issues ( because you have a lot less gas in the inlet system ). Anybody else out there had any experiance or used this system before?

BT

I have had 3 cars on gas, this is my third:

I have just had my VXII SS commodre converted at LPGAS 1 at Lilydale with the new system. It was dyno tuned at the same time and runs fine. I drive it just as hard on gas as do petrol. Sligtly less power on gas, but a lot lighter on the pocket each time i fill up. I get about 40km's less per tank. Same size as the fuel tank. Message me if you want to know more VT2VEight.
 
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