VE Track Car Adventures

[K-Man]

Hello Everyone.

I have a 2006 VE SSV, which I am now going to use solely as a weekender and Track day car.

I have started this thread to detail the things I learn along the way, to help others who want to race. Hopefully it will save you the time and money I have spent looking for the optimal solution.
The track will also be the ultimate proving ground for the mods I have done to the VE - If it can survive the track, they get the K-Man Golden tick of approval, a coveted award. Firstly, I will list the cars mods so people can clearly see what has been done.

Cam - 232/233 512
Ported heads
Pacemaker Headers 1 3/4", Hi flow cats, Twin 3" exhaust
3.7 ratio Diff
Tex Z-Grip Clutch
6 Piston Brembos front, 4 pot rears
DMS 40mm Coilovers front, stock rear Suspension (long story)
20" Camaro wheels

340rwkw

Ok here's a few piccies




I did a session last year before I installed the Brembos, and already learned a few nuggets of wisdom that I can pass now for VE owners, broken up into categories.

Tyres
Achilles. Garbage. End that.
Currently running Khumo Ku 31's they were on special and at the time I was broke. They went well for a street tyre, 32Psi cold = 41psi after they heated up.

Wheels
I have the 20" Camaro wheels on the car. These are heavy. Like, seriously heavy. They look boss but are unsuited to track work. Sadly I didn't know this when I bought them, and I don't have much money now to change them. I plan to get some VF Redline wheels 2nd hand to use. These have the advantage of being light, strong, smaller diameter and are staggered (245 front 275 rear). Given they will be track only wheels they will be fitted with good rubber.

But for now the super heavy Camaro wheels will have to do.

I have decided on 18 TSW Nurburgring wheels as my track specials, these clear the brakes and are one of the few 18" wheels that will. $500 a pop isnt cheap though.

VE Wheel info
PCD - 5x120
Center Bore - 66.9mm
Size and offset to fit
VE / VF Wheels front offset - 36
VE / VF Wheels front width - 8.5 (255 tyres)
VE / VF Wheels rear offset - 57
VE / VF Wheels rear size - 9.5" (275 or 285 tyres)

Suspension


Brakes
Depending on your track, the stockies may be somewhat useful. There were several cars at the track day that toasted their brakes here at Mallala, which is apparently known for being harsh, after 3 laps. That's it, 3 laps.
However not all is lost. There was a lad with a stock Clubby that managed to last the 20 minute sprint reasonably well. This means all those with the 4 piston Redline Brembos, depending where you are and how long you race, they may be enough.

Sadly, my Harrop 'Monster' kit with 4 pot calipers all round only lasted to the 15 minute mark. Suitable for track use they said. These are good they said. They were wrong. $5k down the drain. Don't Buy Harrop unless its the 6 pot kit. And honestly, if you're going to spend $6500 on brakes get what I have and save yourself a ton of coin in the process.

The 6 Pot Brembos were outstanding. Took everything I threw at them without fade or any other issue. Again there was a stock VE GTS, who also had no issues with his brakes.

Engine
The cam I have in the car is pretty big, as a daily I got over it soon enough but on the track its wonderful, making power all the way to 6500rpm. All 340rwkw of it.

I also overfilled the oil by 1litre beforehand to ward off starvation. No dramas there. I have since purchased one of these;
VE Oil Pan Baffle - Improved Racing

Its supposed to eliminate a lot of the oil problems experienced when we track LS series cars. The gold standard would be a dry sump setup, but who has the money? One of these should be some cheap insurance against oil starvation. Installation was easy. Also my engine is still in one piece, so while that fact is difficult to attribute to this baffle, it certainly helps.

Transmission
So my clutch Slave cylinder packed it in on the 2nd lap of the 2nd session. Not fun. Got the Clutch pedal stuck to the floor, fluid pissed out somewhere. Apparently this is a common problem. My Mechanic is currently building a billet alloy one, but you can also get them from Mal Wood Automotive.


Power Steering Reservoir
Turns out its not watertight! Who knew. A combination of tight turns an heat caused the fluid to leak out of the lid, into my engine bay. Theres heaps of Aluminium ones around, pick one up, and while you're at it, fit a power steering cooler.

Vehicle Stats
Mass (measured + driver) - 1970kg / 972F / 948R (then 50kg for fuel)
Drag Coefficient - 0.35
Downforce Coeff - 0.25
VE Frontal Area - 2.66m
Air density - 1.2kg/m (Standard day)

You will have to search the net for the friction values of your particular tyre;

VE SSV Manual Gear Ratios;
1st - 3.01
2nd - 2.07
3rd - 1.43
4th - 1.00
5th - .84
6th - .57

Final Drive - 3.71 (yours may be different)
Drive efficiency - 85%

Resources
Far North Racing - Home
OptimumG - Vehicle Dynamics Solutions
Tire friction and rolling coefficients
Technical Papers - OptimumG <<< Cracking read on springs and Dampers


So that's it for now, my next track day is on ? .

Mallala 12 Feb - Predicted lap times - 90sec
- Actual Lap times -

K-man

 

[_R_J_K_]

Sounding good.

If you're after better handling and slightly better acceleration (depending on tyre size) I'd be looking at a set of well thought out 18's (decent offsets and widths etc...). Not to mention you'll save a bit of weight (depending on your choice) and the tyres are cheaper. I doubt the Redlines will be that much lighter. Also, go for equal width rims and tyres on all four corners so you can attack corners better.

 

[ducker85]

Great idea!! I'll be watching this thread closely. If I had the coin I'd be tempted to do the same thing

What Achilles did you have? The ATR, ATR 2 or the 123 semi slicks??

I love the look of those Camaro 20s!!!! My HSV wheels are super heavy too tho, light weight wheel are a must.

 

[SV6GUY]

I think you need to give the suspension a bit more attention, some vital bushings, sway bars and quality rear dampers to match the front DMS coilovers should bring the car a long way. Good choice on the wheels, a staggered set up will tend to under steer more frequently than a square setup; however, with 340rwkw i can't blame you. should be fun :thumbsup:

I have 4 pot brembos all round and they were cactus after a spirited run through the hills. Unfortunately i didn't even make it to the bottom, annoying considering it's a top tier kit (T3 rotors and QFM HPX pads). From what i read on Camaro5, the 4 pots will perform substantially better than stock but suffer fade and the 6 pots will perform on par with the 4 pots but will not fade. Goodluck!

 

[K-Man]

I think you need to give the suspension a bit more attention, some vital bushings, sway bars and quality rear dampers to match the front DMS coilovers should bring the car a long way. Good choice on the wheels, a staggered set up will tend to under steer more frequently than a square setup; however, with 340rwkw i can't blame you. should be fun :thumbsup:

I have 4 pot brembos all round and they were cactus after a spirited run through the hills. Unfortunately i didn't even make it to the bottom, annoying considering it's a top tier kit (T3 rotors and QFM HPX pads). From what i read on Camaro5, the 4 pots will perform substantially better than stock but suffer fade and the 6 pots will perform on par with the 4 pots but will not fade. Goodluck!

Thanks for the Info SV6GUY, I was super pissed my old Harrops didn't last. If my 6 pot Brembos fade, the only kit up is a $15k Alcon. So I'll report back on how they do.

I Agree with the suspension, its on the to do list but I am getting married soon and the disposable income isn't what it used to be

I have decided on some 18" wheels for track days, TSW Nurburgring. They are fitted by the G8 Guys in the States and are some of the few which fit over big brakes.
TSW Nurburgring 18x9.5 installed. - Pontiac G8 Forum: G8 Forums - G8Board.com
Anyone run 18" wheels with Brembos/Camaro/CTS-V brakes? - Pontiac G8 Forum: G8 Forums - G8Board.com

 

[Deuce]

you could look at removing spotlights and running flexitubes from there to the back of the brakes to aid cooling.
The faster you go the cooler they get and the more you can stomp on them. (In theory)

Might help bridge the gap a little between each kit. (one can only hope)

It'll be cheap and easily reversable if you change your mind.

Other than that, Keep up the good work and reports.

 

[SV6GUY]

Thanks for the Info SV6GUY, I was super pissed my old Harrops didn't last. If my 6 pot Brembos fade, the only kit up is a $15k Alcon. So I'll report back on how they do.

I Agree with the suspension, its on the to do list but I am getting married soon and the disposable income isn't what it used to be

I have decided on some 18" wheels for track days, TSW Nurburgring. They are fitted by the G8 Guys in the States and are some of the few which fit over big brakes.
TSW Nurburgring 18x9.5 installed. - Pontiac G8 Forum: G8 Forums - G8Board.com
Anyone run 18" wheels with Brembos/Camaro/CTS-V brakes? - Pontiac G8 Forum: G8 Forums - G8Board.com

YES! those are some awesome wheels! i love the G8 forums, they're so technically advanced on suspension/brakes it's awesome. What tire setup are you going to run with? i have 9.5" wide wheels all round and i want to run 275s front and rear when i'm due for tires, if you go down that route before i get a chance to i'll be watching very closely. Good choice on ditching the Achilles, i had the khumos ku31 tires in the past and was pretty impressed with their performance as a mid range tire.

Ah yes, priorities. If you can get away with spending just under $200 install a front sway bar, it's the best bang for buck mod you can buy for handling. I found it reduced both oversteer and understeer. If you want another bang for buck mod, invest $50 odd on castor lock washers than put in some serious negative camber once you get a wheel alignment, it'll vastly improve steering feel and grip. Everything else becomes a bit too expensive but make sure your strut top bushings are in good nick too by checking that the rubber donut in the engine bay is close to the strut tower.

Please do, i want 6 pots but i'm just waiting on DBA to release a T3 set up for it, which is not far off from what i've heard. Have you been running new brake fluid, some high performance stuff? I found it to helped me quite a bit.

 

[SnowDoggyDogg]

Have you considered ditching the rear seats and maybe getting race seats for the front? If it's just a weekender/track car and your getting married maybe you don't need the 5 seats? Good way to cut some serious weight.

 

[Smashfist]

You'll find the VE will be VERY harsh on consumables. It might handle well but it's still very heavy for race car purposes. I thought about doing the same (VE parts and cars are very easy to come by for me) but I've decided to start on a lighter base car.

 

[K-Man]

Hey all, some seriously good ideas here. Lightening the car is a serious consideration, weight is the enemy with so many things. As time has gone on, I've added heavier wheels and heavier brakes which cant be good. Ill see what parts of the car can easily go on a diet, the rear seats are a good idea from snowdog, I can count on one hand how many time times I've carried people in the back.

I've been happy with the Khumo KU31 for a street tyre, it remains to be seen if they are any good on the track, but I will do a full rundown on what worked and what didn't after the day. I suspect any tyres on a 20" rim will struggle.

I found superpro 29mm and rear 22mm sway bars for $450, a good deal in my book, but I'll wait until next pay before I decide - I still need to install the Oil sump baffle.

Please do, i want 6 pots but i'm just waiting on DBA to release a T3 set up for it, which is not far off from what i've heard. Have you been running new brake fluid, some high performance stuff? I found it to helped me quite a bit.

Do the 6 pot upgrade, I did mine 12 months ago, since then prices have gone down, choices on the rears have gone up. I got the floating 2 piece Brembo rotor for the front, then took to a machine shop for some basic slotting. You can get Alcon rotors for these in the States, but no-one I spoke to would ship them to me.