coolant change method question

[Brett_jjj]

thanks for the quick reply. sorry i forgot to mention it was for an ecotec VY. just wondering brett, do you actually remove the knock sensor when you use the method you stated? (i'm not sure if the VS has the knock sensors as drain plugs) i can only see the premixing the concentrate method you mentioned working out if you get all of the coolant or water or whatever may be left in the block out so its completely dry before adding the coolant mixture is all.

The VS ecotec has the two knock sensors , same as VY V6. I dont bother going to all the trouble to remove the knock sensors, I just flush out the cooling system until the water coming out of the engine block is clean. Other people on here before have gone to the trouble of removing the knock sensors, only to find that either no coolant even came out of them, or just a tiny amount of coolant dribbled out of them, so its not worth removing them unles your atually replacing the sensors thremselves.. Even Any water thats left in the block will make bugger all difference to the coolant/distilled water mix. The VS also is supposed to hold 12 litres but it never takes this much when refilling, which is why its best to mix the coolant and water first to 50/50, then fill the system.

 

[Brett_jjj]

Using tap water is fine, rain water is about as good as distilled but steer clear of bore water. Also it's the inhibitor in the coolant that stops the corrosion not the coolant itself you will probably find a 50/50 mix of coolant will be overkill, at most maybe 20% concentrate and add an inhibitor if your concerned about corrosion! Or you could just run distilled/demineralised water and redline water wetter (that's what I'm running and got no issues of corrosion or overheating)

Most tap water is full of minerals and contaminants, even through it may "look and taste clean"' so distilled water is always best, plus bottles of distilled water only cost a couple of dollars at the supermarket etc, so its not like its expensive or whatever. Rainwater caught in a plastic containers is pretty much the same as demineralised/distilled water.

 

[slowandlow]

The VS ecotec has the two knock sensors , same as VY V6. I dont bother going to all the trouble to remove the knock sensors, I just flush out the cooling system until the water coming out of the engine block is clean. Other people on here before have gone to the trouble of removing the knock sensors, only to find that either no coolant even came out of them, or just a tiny amount of coolant dribbled out of them, so its not worth removing them unles your atually replacing the sensors thremselves.. Even Any water thats left in the block will make bugger all difference to the coolant/distilled water mix. The VS also is supposed to hold 12 litres but it never takes this much when refilling, which is why its best to mix the coolant and water first to 50/50, then fill the system.

im really confused by your method now. you said before you never use tap water, but you said you flush out the cooling system with it, and dont remove the knock sensors, followed by using a 50/50 mix to fill the system. i know that if you dont remove the knock sensors, no more than 6 litres of fluid will come out of the 12 litres of cooling system fluids. so if you have flushed the system with tap water until the fluid coming out is clear tap water, then proceed to add a 50% distilled water and 50% coolant mix (premixed by yourself first as you said) that means you would only be able to add 6 litres roughly of your distilled water/coolant mix. meaning, the 12 litres content of your cooling system is 50% (6litres) clear tap water, 25% of concentrate coolant (3litres) and 25% distilled water (3 litres) equalling the 12 litres in your cooling system. if thats correct it sounds like you have a weaker than recommended amount of coolant and more tap water than distilled. am i misunderstanding you or is that right?
also, i have read in knock sensor threads that if you remove the knock sensors, no coolant will come out, until you stick a screwdriver in the knock sensor hole through all the gunk that has built up, then all the block held coolant comes out in a hurry.
sorry if i am misunderstanding you, but what im reading from you sounds conflicting to other parts of what youre saying. and this is the situation that has confused me in all the other threads and posts from other people that use this method

 

[Brett_jjj]

im really confused by your method now. you said before you never use tap water, but you said you flush out the cooling system with it, and dont remove the knock sensors, followed by using a 50/50 mix to fill the system. i know that if you dont remove the knock sensors, no more than 6 litres of fluid will come out of the 12 litres of cooling system fluids. so if you have flushed the system with tap water until the fluid coming out is clear tap water, then proceed to add a 50% distilled water and 50% coolant mix (premixed by yourself first as you said) that means you would only be able to add 6 litres roughly of your distilled water/coolant mix. meaning, the 12 litres content of your cooling system is 50% (6litres) clear tap water, 25% of concentrate coolant (3litres) and 25% distilled water (3 litres) equalling the 12 litres in your cooling system. if thats correct it sounds like you have a weaker than recommended amount of coolant and more tap water than distilled. am i misunderstanding you or is that right?
also, i have read in knock sensor threads that if you remove the knock sensors, no coolant will come out, until you stick a screwdriver in the knock sensor hole through all the gunk that has built up, then all the block held coolant comes out in a hurry.
sorry if i am misunderstanding you, but what im reading from you sounds conflicting to other parts of what youre saying. and this is the situation that has confused me in all the other threads and posts from other people that use this method

I wouldnt take any notice of the "12 litre" crap, Ive never seen these cars (VS models im talking about, VT may be different) hold 12 litres of coolant, even with a completely dry rebuilt engine just fitted they dont hold 12 litres. As someone else said before, the little bit of water thats left in the block after its flushed out will hardly matter mixed with the new coolant and distilled water mix. (this is why I said before I mix my cooloant slightly stronger than the recommended 50/50). Even when theres no crud buildup in behind the knock sensors, theres hardy and coolant comes out of them when there removed. Ive been using my previously posted method for years now with my VS, and its cooling system has always been spottlessly clean and has never given me an ounce of trouble in the 8 or 9 years Ive had the car, so I must be doing something right, considering the high amount of cooling system problems people seem to have with these cars.

 

[slowandlow]

wow! holden and the workshop manuals dont even know how much coolant goes in their engines. how dumb are they. haha
well, as long as my cooling system doesnt crap itself ill be happy. i guess i will be fine with what ive done

 

[cactus]

I've done it both ways but you should be able to do a good job without taking the knock sensors out. Theres another can of worms with the knock sensors, when you take them out they are often corroded and could be a couple of mmm shorter than new ones. I didnt want to put them back in so I forked out for news ones.

Some guys say they dont get anything out the knock sensors but thats only because the crud settles in the hole then is baked from engine heat to completely (or partially) seal off the whole, so when you take the knock sensor out, no water comes out. To fix this, you get a screwdriver or pin punch and break the crud until the coolant runs freely. You may have to tap the pin punch with a hammer to break the crud, it goes like concrete.

Anyway, I had no trouble getting 5 litres of coolant in, even with the knock sensors in. I drop the bottom radiator hose and the hose on the other side that goes to the heater(after its flushed). Leave the engine running to let the water pump, pump out the water until it stops coming out.

Edit, Sorry someone already mentioned about the knock sensors. Anyway, I think the 12 litres includes the coolant bottle, that holds at least a couple of litres but either way, you should be able to get 5 litres of coolant in, if its a little more or a little less its not going to make much difference.

 

[slowandlow]

I've done it both ways but you should be able to do a good job without taking the knock sensors out. Theres another can of worms with the knock sensors, when you take them out they are often corroded and could be a couple of mmm shorter than new ones. I didnt want to put them back in so I forked out for news ones.

Some guys say they dont get anything out the knock sensors but thats only because the crud settles in the hole then is baked from engine heat to completely (or partially) seal off the whole, so when you take the knock sensor out, no water comes out. To fix this, you get a screwdriver or pin punch and break the crud until the coolant runs freely. You may have to tap the pin punch with a hammer to break the crud, it goes like concrete.

Anyway, I had no trouble getting 5 litres of coolant in, even with the knock sensors in. I drop the bottom radiator hose and the hose on the other side that goes to the heater(after its flushed). Leave the engine running to let the water pump, pump out the water until it stops coming out.

Edit, Sorry someone already mentioned about the knock sensors. Anyway, I think the 12 litres includes the coolant bottle, that holds at least a couple of litres but either way, you should be able to get 5 litres of coolant in, if its a little more or a little less its not going to make much difference.

thats the other main reason why i didnt take out the knock sensors. it sounds easy to make a bigger job and cost for yourself than the original job of changing the coolant in having to fork out for new sensors. how much extra coolant do you think you got out by removing the knock sensors cactus?
i got 4.5 litres out by just dropping the 2 radiator hoses

 

[cactus]

thats the other main reason why i didnt take out the knock sensors. it sounds easy to make a bigger job and cost for yourself than the original job of changing the coolant in having to fork out for new sensors. how much extra coolant do you think you got out by removing the knock sensors cactus?
i got 4.5 litres out by just dropping the 2 radiator hoses

Hi, Would have been about 3 litres maybe 4. Its hard to tell but it took a good minute for the water to drain. Theres definitely a reasonable amount of water in the block. You should easily get 5 litres of coolant in without doing the knock sensors but I take the heater hose off too, can be a couple of litres in the hoses and heater. Anyway 4.5 litres of coolant is plenty, as long as the water is flushed clean and flushing is done with the heater on that should be plenty.

 

[slowandlow]

i flushed mine with water about 5 times in one day and after that the water still came out with a slight green tinge to it. not much.... but i thought it would have been crystal clear by then

 

[krylothe]

Using tap water is fine, rain water is about as good as distilled but steer clear of bore water. Also it's the inhibitor in the coolant that stops the corrosion not the coolant itself you will probably find a 50/50 mix of coolant will be overkill, at most maybe 20% concentrate and add an inhibitor if your concerned about corrosion! Or you could just run distilled/demineralised water and redline water wetter (that's what I'm running and got no issues of corrosion or overheating)

Most tap water is full of minerals and contaminants, even through it may "look and taste clean"' so distilled water is always best, plus bottles of distilled water only cost a couple of dollars at the supermarket etc, so its not like its expensive or whatever. Rainwater caught in a plastic containers is pretty much the same as demineralised/distilled water.

True distilled water will allow much longer service intervals but tap water is still sufficient for maybe 30000-50000 km. but as I said distilled or demineralised water plus water wetter is great stuff, i seem to be able to give the ve much more of a thrashing without the overheating!