Electric Seat wiring - Really need some advice.

[richard300]

So, i recently purchased a WH Caprice interior for my wife's VX Berlina...

It looks great, but i can't get the the drivers seat to work. The Berlina had a basic electric seat on the drivers side (so there is power from the car) I have run from this power/negative supply - two wires to the passenger seat (the Berlina had a manual passenger seat) and that seat works fine.

However, having connected the same power/negative supply to the (i assume) correct corresponding wires on the drivers seat, I find i have no movement at all when i operate the switches on the seat.

There are lots of 'thin' wires of varying colours - which i assume are for the memory functions? And 3 'thick' wires.... two of which i am using, believing them to be the positive/negative - but i have no idea what the third 'thick' wire might be (Coloured Brown/Blue on the harness that comes from the seat into Purple/red on the harness that i cut from the Caprice.

Below is a diagram of the wiring that i am faced with (i have not included the looms for the seat belt/air bags)... Does anyone have any ideas of what wires i should be connecting my power and negative (from the car) so that i can get the seat to move?
I am not to bothered about the memory function....

Also, here are some pics of the interior fitted in the Berlina, looks great, but my wife cant drive the car in the current seat position - And is now demanding i put the crappy old cloth interior back in the car unless i can gett it working by the end of the week.

 

[Tony310864]

I do not know the answer to your question but I am thinking that the drivers might need the memory module to be able to make it work.
Is the original seat electric? Because if is you may be able to swop the rails from your old seat to the new seat and get it working, Or see if you can rewire the basic seat function the same as the passenger seat.
Sorry I can not give you a defiant answer as I am not familiar with the memory seats.

Tony.

 

[Nitro_X]

Your interior upgrade looks great.
Note: I'm not specifically familiar with this model or seat electronics, but I do have a background in electronics, so the following is just a process of intelligent guessing

1. Is A/B a plug & socket loom both from the Caprice, if so, why are the colour codes on the wires different? ie: A wire's colour codes don't match B wire's colour codes

2. Either your assumption that you've connected to the power wires on harness B is wrong, or, it's correct but the electrical system requires certain other wires to be connected appropriately for the electronics to function correctly on the driver seat.
The driver's seat will have at least 3 functions: forward, back and tilt, and probably two electric motors.
If the Caprice had driver seat preference memory settings, then there would also be position sensors, so this would be the reason for so many wires in the loom. Which would include power for 2 electric motors, lever switches to activate motor operation (forward/back/tilt) and multiple position sensors.

3. Ideally, we would need the actual wiring diagram for the Caprice's seat electronics to work out what each wire is used for.

4. Did the Caprice passenger seat have it's own plug/wiring loom? What functions does this seat have?

 

[richard300]

Hi Tony & Nitro - Thanks for the feedback.
Tony, I have heard that possible I may need to bypass the memory module? I guess this is mounted under the seat?

Nitro - To answer your questions:

A/B plug/sockets are both from the same car.... A is complete and runs from the seat and B I cut from the loom of the Caprice.
I thought it strange that the colours did not match, but not being savvy on car electronics, I though maybe this was just the way things are - I guess not?

As far as wiring (plug) that came from the Caprice passenger seat - that was just a black/blue wire and an orange/Black wire.


Not that I expect you to put time into solving my problem, but below are the wiring diagrams for the memory seat - The trouble is, it means nothing to me.
I am capable of running wires and stripping and connecting them, but not smart enough to actually know how to translate the diagram.

Does anything obvious stand out.....?

 

[Nitro_X]

Ok, yeah, I can decipher most of it. But it won't be a simple process to get things to work properly, doing it remotely via a forum.

It's all microprocessor controlled. There's 4 separate electric motors with built-in electronic encoders (position sensors) which are mechanically linked to the motors. And each motor having a forward/reverse spindle rotation.

1. Can you upload a pdf or high res image of both schematics that I can copy to my computer?

• 
  When I try to zoom in on those inserted images, it's a little blurry and I need to be able to read more detail

2. Can you tell me if there are any electronic modules in or under the seat assemblies?

• The Switch Asm (S51)-driver control, is either on the side of the seat somewhere, or on the centre console of original vehicle but the 4 motor drive units (Y64, Y67, Y69, Y74) will be under the seat. But not sure about the Module Asm (A21)

• These motors are slightly different to a motor which spins in one direction, they are designed so that varying the voltage potential on each terminal changes the spin direction, which on the driver's seat, is controlled by the microprocessor module (A21)

3. Is there a 3 position lever with spring return to centre (or push buttons) on the passenger seat?

• If so, and this gives you fwd/back motion, it suggests a small control module is mounted under this seat and requires only 2 power wires (+/-), because you won't get fwd/rev on a motor with only a fixed (+12V) and (-) ground wire.

ps
I'm thinking that the main Control/Memory module (A21) is still in the original vehicle and the driver seat wiring loom (A/B) is just the wire connections to the seat switches and actuator/motor assemblies.
Also, if you did connect the +12V or ground wire to the wrong point and powered it up, it's possible to damage one of the actuators.
Maybe the driver seat controls are on the centre console of the original vehicle??....(need more info).

 

[richard300]

Ok - So i am back in Australia after an extended stay in the UK and keen to put the car back on the road and WITH the leather interior.
Thank you for the posts above, and apologies that i took so long to respond!!

I found an other post (which now for the life of me i cant find - Or i would have posted it as a link) which basically said that the chap 'by-passed' the memory module??
I have taken the side off the drivers seat (the switch panel) and wondering if anyone thinks that If i connect the corresponding wires from the plug (circled in RED) and connected them directly to the corresponding wired from the plugs (Circled in Blue) - Would this effectively be 'Bypassing the memory module).

Again - I am not bothered about having the memory function.

 

[richard300]

Ok - So I managed to get the seat working!!

Having consulted two auto electricians (both with 20+ years of experience) and my local commodore wreckers. I was told the following:

1. The only way to do it, is to change the seat base to the original Berlina one and put up with limited adjustability - Commodore wrecker.
2. It will never work without the original Caprice BCM - Auto electrician 1
3. Original caprice BCM needed OR complete re-wire of seat with potential bill of "a few hundred dollars" - Auto electrician 2

But still, even though I have never even re-wired a car stereo, never mind tackling this project - I thought there must be a simpler way.

So I removed the passenger seat (that works from just a positive/negative connection) and doesn't have memory, and I Copied the wiring.
Basically I cut the wires going into seat movement switch multi plug and wired them directly to 6 wires from the memory module plug (the one pictured on the right hand side on the previous picture) and 2 wired from the little black plug that comes from the seat backrest.
I traced the wires from the motors and cross referenced the plug on the passenger seat before connecting them.
This left me with 1 red (live0 coming from the (seat movement switch) multi plug. The passenger seat plug had the Red plus a black. I wired up a negative to the driver side multi plug (where there was an empty port) and then ran this red and Black to the orange and black coming from the car and connected the red and black from the passenger seat to these wires - AND NOW I HAVE TWO WORKING SEATS!!!

The whole thing (including removing and re-fitting the seats, took 2 hours!!

Just thought I would post the above in case anyone else finds themselves in this position and stumbles across this thread.

 

[MYVESSV8]

post pics of completed wiring, oh and very well done!

 

[Mpv]

Got a leather interior from hsv, fitting into a vy

Ok - So I managed to get the seat working!!

Having consulted two auto electricians (both with 20+ years of experience) and my local commodore wreckers. I was told the following:

1. The only way to do it, is to change the seat base to the original Berlina one and put up with limited adjustability - Commodore wrecker.
2. It will never work without the original Caprice BCM - Auto electrician 1
3. Original caprice BCM needed OR complete re-wire of seat with potential bill of "a few hundred dollars" - Auto electrician 2

But still, even though I have never even re-wired a car stereo, never mind tackling this project - I thought there must be a simpler way.

So I removed the passenger seat (that works from just a positive/negative connection) and doesn't have memory, and I Copied the wiring.
Basically I cut the wires going into seat movement switch multi plug and wired them directly to 6 wires from the memory module plug (the one pictured on the right hand side on the previous picture) and 2 wired from the little black plug that comes from the seat backrest.
I traced the wires from the motors and cross referenced the plug on the passenger seat before connecting them.
This left me with 1 red (live0 coming from the (seat movement switch) multi plug. The passenger seat plug had the Red plus a black. I wired up a negative to the driver side multi plug (where there was an empty port) and then ran this red and Black to the orange and black coming from the car and connected the red and black from the passenger seat to these wires - AND NOW I HAVE TWO WORKING SEATS!!!

The whole thing (including removing and re-fitting the seats, took 2 hours!!

Just thought I would post the above in case anyone else finds themselves in this position and stumbles across this thread.

Wondered if this got the memory working, or does it just operate the same as the passenger seat

 

[Mpv]

Hi Richard just wondering if your workaround managed to get the memory working or does it just operate the same as the passenger seat