Help on upgrading alloytec cams and valve springs

[oi nah]

Gday, I’m just looking for some help with doing cams and valve springs, I’ve bought the cams already because they came with a cpr6 and a bunch of other things for extremely cheap.
Im not looking to be told that I shouldn’t do it n what not, and I’m open to any ideas anyone has.

So to start off with, I’ve found that there is pretty much nothing online to do with replacing camshafts on alloytecs and same with valve springs, there’s a few forums hanging around but nothing really in depth. I’ve taken a look at the service manual and it seems like that’s my best bet. I’m trying to replace the cams without removing the timing cover, and it seems like it’s possible with the timing retainer tool. The main question is how do i use this tool? From the looks of it I place it in between the two tensioners and tighten it, not too sure though.
And the next thing is valve springs, cause I’m gonna be keeping the heads on it’s gonna be a lot harder because of the valves falling down into the block. I’ve seen most people used compressed air, I’ve also seen people put rope down into the cylinders. I’m thinking compressed air is the go, but won’t I have to rotate the engine to close the valves that I’m putting the compressed air into?
And lastly the tool to compress the springs, the manual says I should use this (EN 46110). But it costs around $500!! Is there any alternative, I saw a forum of a guy who bought a tool and he had to modify it heaps and took him ages to do. If anyone has any links to forums or videos regarding cams and valve springs that would help a lot. I’ve seen there’s a fair few timing chain videos but I’m trying to do it with the timing cover still on.
If anyone could help that would be appreciated, I’m trying my best to tackle this myself.
Cheers.

 

[losh1971]

Sounds like you might have the mechanicals covered. Best find a tuner before you get too deep because very few places will tune these, and even fewer successfully.

 

[oi nah]

Sounds like you might have the mechanicals covered. Best find a tuner before you get too deep because very few places will tune these, and even fewer successfully.

Yeah true I’ve got it tuned before not sure if they’ll tune it after the cams n what not. Have you got any tips on doing cams on these engine?

 

[shane_3800]

Dude you might be able to do it, I highly doubt it.
But any mechanic will just pull the timing cover.
If you have to ask you don't have the knowledge and skill to pull off a manvour like this if it is even possible.

 

[krusing]

"and it seems like it’s possible with the timing retainer tool. The main question is how do I use this tool?"

If you are asking this question,
I think you need to get a GOOD mechanic to do it,
Because its going to go pear shape,
and end in Tears and Money !

There is a lot of experience and tools required for your upgrade,
And it won't happen over night,
MHO, get it done right the first time.

 

[oi nah]

Dude you might be able to do it, I highly doubt it.
But any mechanic will just pull the timing cover.
If you have to ask you don't have the knowledge and skill to pull off a manvour like this if it is even possible.

Yeah that’s the other thing I was thinking is pulling the timing cover off and pulling the chains off and even doing the timing chains, cause since there’s so many in depth videos I figured it wouldn’t be too hard. I notice when people are doing just timing chains they don’t move the camshafts at all, so how would that work when changing them, just put the sprocket on the new cam and place the cam in with the 2 flats facing up? But yeah I know I don’t have the knowledge, but everyone starts somewhere, even a skilled mechanic was where I was at at one point. That’s why I’m on here so I can learn from people who have experience

 

[oi nah]

"and it seems like it’s possible with the timing retainer tool. The main question is how do I use this tool?"

If you are asking this question,
I think you need to get a GOOD mechanic to do it,
Because its going to go pear shape,
and end in Tears and Money !

There is a lot of experience and tools required for your upgrade,
And it won't happen over night,
MHO, get it done right the first time.

Yeah that’s the answer I figured I was going to get, I know I should definitely get someone to do it for me, but im trying to do everything on my car myself, it’s not really about the money for me it’s about learning. And if I do fu*k things up and fu*k the timing, then I can chuck it on a tow truck and get a professional, or even better figure the problem out myself. I don’t want to try and come off as a know it all, im just on here trying to get advice on how to do this.

 

[shane_3800]

Yeah that’s the other thing I was thinking is pulling the timing cover off and pulling the chains off and even doing the timing chains, cause since there’s so many in depth videos I figured it wouldn’t be too hard. I notice when people are doing just timing chains they don’t move the camshafts at all, so how would that work when changing them, just put the sprocket on the new cam and place the cam in with the 2 flats facing up? But yeah I know I don’t have the knowledge, but everyone starts somewhere, even a skilled mechanic was where I was at at one point. That’s why I’m on here so I can learn from people who have experience

It took me about 6 years in the trade before I touched one. I however was a suspension specialist at the time so engine work wasn't my forte.

These are not a beginners engine, yes you have to start somewhere but most learn on a 4 cylinder engine with timing belts..

These engines to align the marks actually need to be spun one way then back the other way so the banks line up, plus to take the phasers off you need cam lock plates that lock in at the back of the cam.

Start by doing a single cam timing belt then move to a dual cam, then you might understand a quad cam.

 

[oi nah]

It took me about 6 years in the trade before I touched one. I however was a suspension specialist at the time so engine work wasn't my forte.

These are not a beginners engine, yes you have to start somewhere but most learn on a 4 cylinder engine with timing belts..

These engines to align the marks actually need to be spun one way then back the other way so the banks line up, plus to take the phasers off you need cam lock plates that lock in at the back of the cam.

Start by doing a single cam timing belt then move to a dual cam, then you might understand a quad cam.

Yeah trust me I would love to work on smaller engines but I have no choice, at work we only work on diffs and gearboxes, and I can’t buy a shitbox car to strip down, I’m only aloud one car at my house. I’ll be doing engine work in tafe when I’m a third year apprentice, so a year or so. Pretty sure they do alloytecs and ecotecs too. And when I was looking at the manual I can take the phasers off by putting a spanner on the camshaft

 

[shane_3800]

Yeah trust me I would love to work on smaller engines but I have no choice, at work we only work on diffs and gearboxes, and I can’t buy a shitbox car to strip down, I’m only aloud one car at my house. I’ll be doing engine work in tafe when I’m a third year apprentice, so a year or so. Pretty sure they do alloytecs and ecotecs too. And when I was looking at the manual I can take the phasers off by putting a spanner on the camshaft
View attachment 262898

If you work at a trans/diff shop, ask one of your bosses trade customers, he'll set you straight.

I work with guys that do amazing things but it takes years of practice.
One is 11 years experience the other is 30+ and I'm 16 years.

If you're an apprentice just wait, your enthusiasm is great but your judgement is clouded by that same enthusiasm.
You will understand when you're older.

Good on you for having a go but it's not shameful to ask for help from your peers and admit when you're out of your depth.
You will learn this.