Tools & Tool Brands

[chrisp]

As I have mentioned, I have had customers question whether they can actually undo wheel nuts, once I have torqued them up with a wrench or torque bar....So my solution has been to hand them a cross brace and get them to undo it and do them back up....

So with customers physcially undoing them and doing them back up with a cross brace, why would you have to use a torque wrench or torque bar to make sure the wheel nuts are tight?

Why? I do it so I have a good idea of what ‘tight’ is. I find tight is very subjective and changes with body positioning and reach. If sit down on the ground and do them up tight, it’ll be different to standing up and doing them up tight.

I’m not sure about letting the customer decide what is tight enough based on their strength (or what they can undo). I’d be inclined to ask them to do them up to what they think is right (with the wheel brace provided with the car) - then hand them a torque wrench! It could be a learning experience for all involved!

I was surprised just how different ‘tight’ perception changes when doing up spark plugs. It’s really easy to do up the easy-to-access spark plugs, and I was surprised just how much force I had to use to get the correct torque on the hard-to-reach spark plugs.

But why guess, just use a torque wrench and know they are correct.

Also, someone mentioned the VE/VF having 14mm studs and requiring a higher torque. They mentioned that it was difficult to get that torque with the wheel brace provided with the car. I can attest that is true and I seem to recall that the Holden wheel brace actually bends/distorts a bit before the correct torque is reached. I use a breaker bar and a torque wrench instead but the OEM wheel brace is still there if needed.

 

[vc commodore]

Why? I do it so I have a good idea of what ‘tight’ is. I find tight is very subjective and changes with body positioning and reach. If sit down on the ground and do them up tight, it’ll be different to standing up and doing them up tight.

I’m not sure about letting the customer decide what is tight enough based on their strength (or what they can undo). I’d be inclined to ask them to do them up to what they think is right (with the wheel brace provided with the car) - then hand them a torque wrench! It could be a learning experience for all involved!

I was surprised just how different ‘tight’ perception changes when doing up spark plugs. It’s really easy to do up the easy-to-access spark plugs, and I was surprised just how much force I had to use to get the correct torque on the hard-to-reach spark plugS.

But why guess, just use a torque wrench and know they are correct.

Also, someone mentioned the VE/VF having 14mm studs and requiring a higher torque. They mentioned that it was difficult to get that torque with the wheel brace provided with the car. I can attest that is true and I seem to recall that the Holden wheel brace actually bends/distorts a bit before the correct torque is reached. I use a breaker bar and a torque wrench instead but the OEM wheel brace is still there if needed.

The correct perception of tight, is the customer/owner doing the wheel nuts up with a cross brace because they're the ones that'll be on the side of the road changing wheels....That's unless you want to provide me with your contact details to pass onto them, just incase they get a flat tyre and you can rush to their aid..

And in all my years being in the trade I have NEVER seen a torque wrench in the boot/back of a vehicle....So the notion of a customer having to buy a torque wrench to ensure their wheels nuts are tight after a wheel change is absolute lunacy...

 

[hademall]

The correct perception of tight, is the customer/owner doing the wheel nuts up with a cross brace because they're the ones that'll be on the side of the road changing wheels....That's unless you want to provide me with your contact details to pass onto them, just incase they get a flat tyre and you can rush to their aid..

And in all my years being in the trade I have NEVER seen a torque wrench in the boot/back of a vehicle....So the notion of a customer having to buy a torque wrench to ensure their wheels nuts are tight after a wheel change is absolute lunacy...

But surely the strength of an individual differs. A 40 kilogram waif, be it a male or female may well have more strength than someone who weighs 70 kilos, or maybe not.
Physical strength in a person can be deceptive. Also the mental strength and the power of ones mind to be able do things physically regardless of our physical weight and stature is factual.
To assume that anybody could tighten a wheel nut to its specific torque would not be something I would bet on.

 

[Immortality]

The question must be asked, how many people change their own tires if/when they get a flat these days?

 

[chrisp]

The correct perception of tight, is the customer/owner doing the wheel nuts up with a cross brace because they're the ones that'll be on the side of the road changing wheels....That's unless you want to provide me with your contact details to pass onto them, just incase they get a flat tyre and you can rush to their aid..

And in all my years being in the trade I have NEVER seen a torque wrench in the boot/back of a vehicle....So the notion of a customer having to buy a torque wrench to ensure their wheels nuts are tight after a wheel change is absolute lunacy...

Maybe tell Holden that they are mad…

 

[vc commodore]

But surely the strength of an individual differs. A 40 kilogram waif, be it a male or female may well have more strength than someone who weighs 70 kilos, or maybe not.
Physical strength in a person can be deceptive. Also the mental strength and the power of ones mind to be able do things physically regardless of our physical weight and stature is factual.
To assume that anybody could tighten a wheel nut to its specific torque would not be something I would bet on.

Yes, physical strength does vary between everyone....Which is why I mentioned the owner/customer doing the wheel nuts up is the best way to check them...

 

[vc commodore]

Maybe tell Holden that they are mad…

View attachment 246856

And tell the owner of the vehicle they are mad when they can't undo wheel nuts on the side of the road because the wheel nuts were too tight as per factory tensions.

And being very very polite....How about getting into the real world, not the fantasy internet world with this stuff....There are real people out there, that get real flat tyres that physcially can't undo a wheel nut that has been tightened to factory tensions

 

[vc commodore]

The question must be asked, how many people change their own tires if/when they get a flat these days?

Combined with how many of those people actually check them on the side of the road with a tension wrench.

I suspect the number of people changing the tyres would greatly out number those that check them with a tension wrench

 

[chrisp]

It must be incredibly frustrating for a manufacturer to design a product and go to the trouble of explicitly stating how to correctly look after the product - then have people in the field think they know better/more and having the audacity to tell them to just do their wheel it up as tight as they comfortably can!

Sorry to be so blunt, but this is really getting both silly and serious. Holden actually state to have the wheel nut torque checked after a roadside wheel change. I hardly think suggest people do them up to whatever their individual ability is is sensible. Grandma can have hand-tight wheel nuts because that’s all she can cope with!

 

[Immortality]

Which is why the instruction state to have the wheel nuts checked at the earliest convenience.

Many years I didn't but I also carried a proper wheel brace and not that piece of crap that comes standard in the boot of a car, I'm also about 6'6" and circa 120kg so I know I can torque a wheel nut to 120Nm+ on the side of the road at any time.

We regularly get cars stopping with flat tires on our street and the number of cars that get towed rather than someone changing the tire on the side of the road would be surprising or how many times someone else comes and changes that tire for them. I've done the odd one, I've also lent the odd wheel brace and watched with amusement when people can't get the wheel nuts off. The really surprising part is the number of people who actually drive off after getting a flat without changing the tire.