Holden Commodore Limited Edition models

[dazinau]

Yeah @EternityDre you may have a point but to continue the analogy just as some people get past their other halfs cheating, others may not find it so easy while others again may never want to know of the betrayal . Discussing how others have been cheated on may yield some comfort but it's short lived

Now getting back to cars, the reality is that as long as the masses accept poor service and poor customer care, nothing changes. However, expressing such views within these forums seems not to be the accepted thing either as it's seen as complaining. Hm, maybe i've gone a little overboard though.

Anyway, over the years i've had a number of car related service problems, a number of insurance related problems. And like most, i've navigated some issues rather well while with othersissues i've made blunders. But i've learnt.

Guess i'm trying to pass on my views too strong that keeping the status quo with poor service or poor vehicle feature sets will not improve anything. Rasing our voices may loudly enough (as was the case when Holden tried to kill off the V8 many years ago) may result in some improvements.

Now i don't know what happened with Ford's last hooray, nor the price of those last vehicles as i had no interest in such. But keep in mind that the MSE's were selling in most cases around the $70K+ DA mark during 2017 which was around $15K - $17K more expensive than a SSV Redlines of late 2016 (these were $55K - $53K DA with 5 year warranty & 12 months insurance thrown in). Sadly, dealers started to treat even the SSV-Redline as hens teeth once MSE's were released and started asking around the $65K DA mark which made the MSE seem a better proposition (but the MSE was still over priced in reality).

Do i have buyers remorse, not really as i can afford my toy. Can i still enjoy my car remembering i was taken for a ride... yeah Will i be pissed off if there is another recall bringing into questions the GM L3 certification process; hell yeah

Keeping in mind, around Melbourne, there are some 42 MSE's and 7 Directors available last i did a quick took a couple of days ago. And these vehicles are already a year old... So some may want to live in delusion and not accept reality but when we start to see some MSE's sell around the $63K DA mark, it may be difficult for them not ignore the truth.

PS: Today i was stuck in traffic after visiting a friend with my MSE, and as it was a rather hot 36, the seat coolers would have been great. But it was the crawling traffic that bothered me not the lack of seat coolers

What annoys me most of all is I FELL FOR IT!

I'd hoped Holden would do a special edition, then in late January I read a Motor magazine article saying "Less than a week after Holden's Commodore 'Special Editions' were publically revealed it has been confirmed they have more or less sold out.".... I ended up dropping into Chatswood holden in late March and they said someone had cancelled their order on a Manual but couldn't discount at all - at least I only paid whatever the RRP was and 2K delivery - better than some but a fair way north of what I could get one now for. I did speak to a few dealers after that and they said their motorsports only lasted a few days and definitely had none left so don't really understand why there are so many left now. Would love it for there to be an honest reason.

I'm happy with the car and would probably buy one again if I was making the decision right now (would take a Honda Civic Type R for a test drive though!) but I feel like I've been lied to, either by Holden or the dealer.

Also would have been nice for them to enable the dash performance menu...

 

[duaned]

One should always remember the 1 only thing that comes from a car salesperson's mouth. Bullshit!

 

[Skylarking]

One should always remember the 1 only thing that comes from a car salesperson's mouth. Bullshit!

+1

 

[DJ_m]

Think about it, $18k engineering costs (5 engineers working on this for a month)

I'm thinking about it and after only a few moments can see that your figures are in cloud cuckoo land. Putting aside for one moment everything else it would take to implement anything new to a vehicle, the direct employment costs alone are many times your numbers. Add in the true costs of 'employing someone' - physical space, training, HR, recruitment costs, compliance with umpteen mandatory employment rules, liability, etc etc etc. From managing large businesses I can tell you that even an customer service person costs 2-3 times actual salary to employ. Engineers would be a different factor again given ongoing training, technology and compliance. In addition to engineers you have to factor in quality control, re jigging and retooling of production, re-writing and editing of manuals, re-writing and editing of service manuals, stocking of spare parts, marketing,...the list goes on and on and on.

If you think you are able to take a right hand drive commodore and re-engineer it to have cooled seats for $18k then you should seriously consider taking over the production facility and building a car. You'll be rich in no time.

Personally I'd much rather have cooled seats than heated seats but the car does not have them so I'll live with it. I bought it in the knowledge of the spec so no point bitching about it now.

More importantly I'd rather have an 'infotainment' system that was not a complete piece of crap, featuring apps that have been defunct for nearly a year (along with multiple other failings). This is something that can be kept up to date with firmware and software so there is no excuse for not keeping your current customers up to date with apps that people use (Spotify?) and maps that are not years out of date.

Whilst the MSE is far from perfect in the technology and features department it is, for my money at least, the best large performance saloon/sedan that can be bought dollar for dollar. By a big margin. I'd go as far as to say, that once you take in to account the adaptability of the MSE with MRC you would have to spend twice as many dollars to beat it.

 

[Skylarking]

@DJ_m , If it takes more than 5 man months, let alone a scary 50 man months, of effort to take an existing electrical system for the front seat coolers in an Australian LHD built vehicle and flip it for an Australian RHD vehicle, then i'm not surprised manufacturing is done down under.

Likely, many of the design costs are structured around methods encumbered by GM owned intellectual proporty belonging to a Bahamian owned GM subsidiary that results in massive cost to Holden and thus deducted from their income. Another GM subsidiary, resident in some other tax free jurisdiction, likley owns the building where the Enginners sit and gaze at their navel while working out how to flip a wiring loom. Yet another subsidiary likley owns the computers located in another tax free jurasdictionthat are used for the computational intensive efforts to flip said wiring loom. With all these costs piling up, one can only wonder what is needed to turn a profit. Poor poor Holden with so many losses to contend with

I'll blame Holywood for starting all this accounting shenanigans and Apple for taking it to the next level

 

[DJ_m]

@DJ_m , If it takes more than 5 man months,

I'm not suggesting it takes any more time than this. I'm suggesting that an estimate of $18,000 is missing at least a zero and probably more. Equipping a vehicle with a new feature necessitates far more than having an engineer sitting at a desk for a few months.

I think we have to be realistic about what a company would spend on a vehicle with a very limited production run at the end of it's life. I read somewhere an interview with one of the lead engineers who stated something to the tune of any available funds they had were spent on implementing the MRC - they felt they had a good drivetrain but the biggest gain could come from addressing the lively handling. I guess they were trying to deliver the best driver's vehicle they could with what they had. I for one am glad they did and can forgive them for not cooling my seat instead. The mylink bullshit system though, well I could stick a screwdriver through the screen everytime I turn it on.

 

[426Cuda]

A poor analog is that my MSE purchase/delivery process was like finding out your girlfriend was cheating on you, so one feels a little violated.

Holdens poor handling of these LE models along with too much bullshit around the 'sold out' mantra, which is now obvious for the lie it was, just reinforces the negatives of no seat coolers, chromatic RVM and the difficulty in getting F A C T S from dealer service or Holden Customer Care (TPMS case in point). This has been a real negative but the big positive is the driveline and suspension so i don't loose sleep

As to your chromatic RVM retrofit, i'd be interested in the technical aspects of what parts are needed and how to install

Here you go:
https://forums.justcommodores.com.au/threads/auto-dimming-mirror-vf2-installation.266650/
BTW. For someone with a dislike of us poor maligned accountants, you certainly luke crunching numbers

 

[Skylarking]

Thanks for the link which seems a very doable and inexpensive mod.
It’s a little frustrating that Holden skimped $165 (the retail parts price) of the electrochromatic mirror in a $70k vehicle.

 

[Skylarking]

I'm not suggesting it takes any more time than this. I'm suggesting that an estimate of $18,000 is missing at least a zero and probably more. Equipping a vehicle with a new feature necessitates far more than having an engineer sitting at a desk for a few months.

I think we have to be realistic about what a company would spend on a vehicle with a very limited production run at the end of it's life. I read somewhere an interview with one of the lead engineers who stated something to the tune of any available funds they had were spent on implementing the MRC - they felt they had a good drivetrain but the biggest gain could come from addressing the lively handling. I guess they were trying to deliver the best driver's vehicle they could with what they had. I for one am glad they did and can forgive them for not cooling my seat instead. The mylink bullshit system though, well I could stick a screwdriver through the screen everytime I turn it on.

Which is why I even multiplied by 10 for 50 man months... so I wasn’t exactly wanting to be literal as such, more wanting to convey the meaning that it wouldn’t have been difficult or costly for each of the 1800 LE vehicles to get cooled seats.

But i can accept that there were limited engineering resources that could spend effort on these LE models which is different to engineering cost being too high thus precluded adding seat coolers. And I also prefer magnetic ride over seat coolers or electrochromatic mirrors

So I think we probably agree more on this issue than the posts seem to indicate

 

[blackve76]

Bathurst holden has 2 MSE manuals nitrate and SOAG

http://www.bathurstholden.com.au/Ve...ake=&model=&trim=&minYear=&maxYear=&maxPrice=

Nitrate auto

http://www.cootaholden.com.au/Vehic...mmodore-Motorsport-Cootamundra-NSW/3117413793

2 directors
http://www.heartlandholdenpenrith.com.au/VehicleSearchResults?search=new&make=Holden