Question on HF20 Wheels

[VS 5.0]

I always thought of it as a really judgemental term, exaggerating the badness in the act of applying the rash by using an overtly understated term!

Having said that, I’ve scratched the Commode’s wheels on potholes I couldn’t avoid, but also on concrete car-park dividers that can’t be seen from inside the car and a pointy-outy bit of concrete in the work car-park, as well as at least once on a gutter. The VF is the first car I’ve ever had this issue with, dunno why, I think maybe ‘cos it’s the widest car I’ve ever had by a fair bit?

The A pillars don't help.

 

[RevNev]

I always thought of it as a really judgemental term, exaggerating the badness in the act of applying the rash by using an overtly understated term!

Having said that, I’ve scratched the Commode’s wheels on potholes I couldn’t avoid, but also on concrete car-park dividers that can’t be seen from inside the car and a pointy-outy bit of concrete in the work car-park, as well as at least once on a gutter. The VF is the first car I’ve ever had this issue with, dunno why, I think maybe ‘cos it’s the widest car I’ve ever had by a fair bit?

Fortunately, we don't have much necessity to use tight car parks and avoiding places vulnerable to car park dents probably helps minimise the potential for wheel damage. If you're exposed to tight parking on a daily basis, the risk of wheel damage increases.

 

[Forg]

I particularly dislike the car parks with a 20cm high concrete ledge on both sides of a down-ramp, where you have to get close to full lock to follow the curve, and heading downwards you can’t see that concrete within about 10m of the car! I’ve not hit one of those yet, but they make me antsy!

 

[NJD-1992]

Some may disagree, but I think the silver wheels on my old R8 makes the car look better than my mate's GTS with black wheels on red!

From the front, I think the R8 looks better full stop.

I just cannot get along with the GTS front end! Looks too blocky and out of proportion to me

R8 = great
GTSR = great

my personal fav will always be the Gen F Senator front end

 

[RevNev]

From the front, I think the R8 looks better full stop.

I just cannot get along with the GTS front end! Looks too blocky and out of proportion to me

R8 = great
GTSR = great

my personal fav will always be the Gen F Senator front end

I agree!

I like the Senator bumper with the one-piece grill I think would work well on a Redline without over-emphasising the fitment of odd HSV parts.

 

[NJD-1992]

A proper forged wheel is machined from a billet that has been compacted with extreme force to a particular standard, the reason a good set aftermarket forged wheels today are round 8k.

There's few claims of forged wheels that I'm a bit skeptical are the real deal.

Exactly, a true set of proper 'forged" wheels would certainly be expensive.

I think they are getting fancy with the marketing, but the finish of them make me think that they are actually a cast billet.

Which is then put on a spinning lathe, and then they forcible extrude/spin the heated billet back into the rim shape, like a pottery wheel
This seems to be what many manufacturers call "flow forged"

I ask because Holden were VERY LOUD about the optional HF20's as being forged ... and the person who told you might have gotten confused because VF2 Redline had cast alloys which looked near identical to the forged VF1 MY15-only Redline alloys ... so I'm proposing that maybe they'd confused "VF2 Redline wheels aren't forged" with meaning the HF20's as well as the standard wheels?

Video below shows wheels being made in which the initial "puck" is made from cast alloy. This Id wager Holdens "Forged" wheels are made, given their surface finishes look identical.

The forming is above at 8:40

Whereas on the below video, you can see the difference in a true "Forged" wheel

Between 3:00 and 5:30

Either way, fascinating videos!

Always love manufacturing

Harkens back to when our economy was more than
a.) A mine,
b.) A Farm,
c.) A University
d.) A Ponzi scheme housing market

 

[VF Ute]

I've got the factory's HF20's. Definitely cast.

 

[VS 5.0]

Harkens back to when our economy was more than
a.) A mine,
b.) A Farm,
c.) A University
d.) A Ponzi scheme housing market

e.) baristas

 

[Skylarking]

I'm not a metallurgist but i thought the whole idea of forging was to force the metal's crystalline structures into alignment which is what makes the end piece much lighter and stronger.

And here's where it gets all murky as there are cold forging techniques where colder (heated to low temp) chunks of metal are quickly squashed by huge weighty presses that slam down on the part to force the metal to flow in the desired way to make the part light and strong. Then there is hot forging which seems to heat the metal above its crystalline structure (thus can't be "forged") where it's squeezed in dies to make the part but it's not as strong as cold forged techniques. There's also a bunch of other die forging techniques that If i understand correctly sit between these two types...

Seems over the years the "forged" name has been progressively weakened to encompass cheaper manufacturing methods using varied techniques. But AIUI, spinning has never been classified as forging so not sure wny it became such? Heck wheel hub caps used to be spun and nobody ever called them "forged"..

So is calling rims made by squeeze casting the centres and then spinning the barrels "forged" seems a complete misrepresentation of their construction technique? I'd think so considering the centre is just heat treated cast construction as the end product is simply not as strong as cold forged wheels (and does anyone do that any more?)...

It's really bordering on false advertising or false product representation as in my view spun /= forged so you don't get what you expected... a really light and strong forged rim...

It would be interesting to note the weights of same size rim that are cast, squeeze cast and spun, hot forged and cold forged to compare against but the wheels we buy don't have their manufacturing technique honestly represented and there's no way we'd know their actuall strength differences, so probably a moot point

May be carbon revolution wheels are the go as they are locally made down under but for the cost

 

[panhead]

A proper forged wheel is machined from a billet that has been compacted with extreme force to a particular standard, the reason a good set aftermarket forged wheels today are round 8k.

There's few claims of forged wheels that I'm a bit skeptical are the real deal.

I'm not a metallurgist but i thought the whole idea of forging was to force the metal's crystalline structures into alignment which is what makes the end piece much lighter and stronger.

And here's where it gets all murky as there are cold forging techniques where colder (heated to low temp) chunks of metal are quickly squashed by huge weighty presses that slam down on the part to force the metal to flow in the desired way to make the part light and strong. Then there is hot forging which seems to heat the metal above its crystalline structure (thus can't be "forged") where it's squeezed in dies to make the part but it's not as strong as cold forged techniques. There's also a bunch of other die forging techniques that If i understand correctly sit between these two types...

Seems over the years the "forged" name has been progressively weakened to encompass cheaper manufacturing methods using varied techniques. But AIUI, spinning has never been classified as forging so not sure wny it became such? Heck wheel hub caps used to be spun and nobody ever called them "forged"..

So is calling rims made by squeeze casting the centres and then spinning the barrels "forged" seems a complete misrepresentation of their construction technique? I'd think so considering the centre is just heat treated cast construction as the end product is simply not as strong as cold forged wheels (and does anyone do that any more?)...

It's really bordering on false advertising or false product representation as in my view spun /= forged so you don't get what you expected... a really light and strong forged rim...

It would be interesting to note the weights of same size rim that are cast, squeeze cast and spun, hot forged and cold forged to compare against but the wheels we buy don't have their manufacturing technique honestly represented and there's no way we'd know their actuall strength differences, so probably a moot point

May be carbon revolution wheels are the go as they are locally made down under but for the cost

I have couple of sets of forged rims, a two piece KWC set and a three piece HRE set.

Both have mirror finished polished outers and powered coated centres.

The two piece cost me $6,800 and the three piece $11,000 from California to my door.

Tyres are extra.

There is a huge difference between these two sets of rims compared to those supplied with my Redline Ute.

This is how HRE explains it and make theirs, you can see why they charge the prices they do.

My Rims:

The two piece on the Ute and the 3 piece on the Merc

.