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economy figures in vs 8's

commsirac

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But will they listen to those who drive BOTH V8 an V6 often there for would have a much better idea.

You can ask people on a forum such as this, but clearly you will get some deluded answers due to some being very sensitive about the need to have to justify why they drive a v8( I dont have any problems with that, even myself driving a comm with a v6 in real terms is an extravagance)
Only people that own v8s and v6s should be listened to?
Yeh, years ago, one would have to ask around to know if a car was heavy on fuel or not........clearly as you see in this thread, the answers can be all over the place....ie (400km per tank) or a tank every 2 weeks or other suitably vague rubbish, or are comparing a 20 year old vN v6 which hasnt seen any love for a few years.
Thats one of the reasons as to why we have the government testing standards!
So that one doesnt need to own and carefully monitor fuel consumption for a few years in order to know if a car they are interested in purchasing will be heavy on fuel than another alternative or not!
 

Nobody Actually

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i've got a comparison for you all.


last weekend 3 carloads of us all drove from brisbane to gladstone to attend a wedding.

all up, the trip was 570km one way.


there was don's ve ssv 6.0l v8 auto, 1,200km on the clock which got 10.1/100km

my caprice vs s2 5.0l v8 auto, 229,000km on the clock which got 8.5/100km

and mike's vy berlina 3.6 v6 auto, 35,000km on the clock which got 8.2/100km

all 3 cars were laden with full boots of luggage and atleast 2 grown adult's in each.

and each car is dead stock.

we didn't follow mike up, so i can't say how he drove, but both don and i stuck to the speed limit's, exept for overtaking, where the throttle got quite the workout.

now i'm not picking on anyone's car type, configuration or model, but with those figures, i won't be "upgrading" to a newish v6 or v8 anytime soon.
 

commsirac

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By the way guys, you lose, i had my mate in his vs v6 on the highway at 110km/h last night and this was his exact words when i asked him what it sits on, 'it sits just above the 2' coming from my mate which doesn't know much about cars, that tells me my 2100rpm claim @ 110km/h is correct. unless my mates tacho is out as well as all my previous v6's.

.
What a spin
Do you really take everyone for a fool?

No one challenged the 2100rpm@110km/h for a v6, but they did challenge the earlier nonsense you wrote about a v8 operating at lower revs in overdrive even if it had the same gearing.

In case you have forgotten , here it is again:
thats right, the transmission and diff gearing are exactly the same between the v6 and v8 in the auto, thats why the v8 sits lower in the rpm range @ any given speed, thats also why you can go faster in each gear versus the v6. theres 2 extra pistons pushing the car along so the revs are naturally going to be lower, at 110km/h i sit on exactly 1800-1900rpm the v6 auto revs @ 2100 @ 110
 

vnv8driver

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it doesnt stray away from the fact that a v6 sharing the exact same ratio as a v8 sits higher in the rpm range. your settling that the v6 sits on 2100rpm on the highway at 110, now do you really think my v8 is on 2100rpm as well? remember theres plenty of v8 owners on this site to confirm this

whats your explanation for my car sitting on 1800rpm and a vs v6 on 2100rpm?

magic.
 
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Tas_HSV

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Hi all lol,been keepin an eye on this thread for a while,when im sittin here in a cascade draught fueled mindnumbing state,laughing at all the ****fighting and incorrect information...the mrs says thanx,its kept me in the computer room instead of pesterin her for sex lol,I used to own a VR V6 5 speed,and now own a VR clubby 5 speed,both low klms,extractors,k@n filter and decent exhausts....The V8 is naturally heavier on fuelin stop/start gettin to work traffic,and on the highway,the V8 is heavier on fuel too....JUST.there isnt much in it at all.But the advantage of owning a V8 sure outweighs the extra fuel...sure fuel is expensive,but most people who complain about it,do it while ripping the top off a $15 pack of ciggys,and and sippin on a $4 can of redbull....its not all doom and gloom,just buy a few less choccy bars and redbull during the week(I do...)lol....back to the point...The V6 was very drony to drive,sounded ****,went ****,and used a fair amount of fuel...The V8 uses more,but sounds nice,goes hard and I grin every time i get behind the wheel.....so shove that in ya pipe.....

Yours truly,
The two headed tasmanian,Dan

P.S.....just done 100 km/h up the highway...1800 rpm exactly....in 5th...the 2100 figure isnt from a v6 auto is it?coz my old 5 speed V6 used to sit on....U guessed it...1800 rpm
 
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vnv8driver

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the v6 5 speeds overdrive is slightly differant to the v8's 5th overdrive ratio, even though its such a small differance the revs wont be the same as each other between v6 & v8. im talking auto v's auto, the v8's t5 overdrive ratio is slightly higher so by rights it should rev higher than the v6 in 5th gear yet it revs at the same rpm as the v6 in 5th gear?

Were getting closer to the end of the road.
 
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commsirac

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it doesnt stray away from the fact that a v6 sharing the exact same ratio as a v8 sits higher in the rpm range. your settling that the v6 sits on 2100rpm on the highway at 110, now do you really think my v8 is on 2100rpm as well? remember theres plenty of v8 owners on this site to confirm this

whats your explanation for my car sitting on 1800rpm and a vs v6 on 2100rpm?

magic.

If the two vehicles have the same gearing the revs should be the same for the same road speed.

The only explanations for the rpm to be different are:

the gearing isnt the same
two the rev counters/speedo are out or observer is out.

Perhaps think of it in simple bicycle sprint bike terms, where there is no free wheel.

Lets say a track bike has a fixed front gear of 60 teeth and a rear of 8 teeth.

Lets pretend two identical bikes are made and myself(v6) cyclist and a sprint cyclist(v8) go for a "lazy" ride together.
If we both maintain a cadence of 40rpm, what do you think will be the result......we should move together!
Of course the sprint cyclist has the potential to do nearly triple that
If the gearing and rpm are the same, the road speed will be the same.....it doesnt matter what is driving it.
Hope that helps.
 
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vnv8driver

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Im always open to suggestion and the way your putting it does make it sound feasible, im going by exactly what ive seen in my own personal cars, unless they had slipping transmissions, screwed tacho's or different diff gears im still sticking with my theory.

If the v6 and v8 t5 manuals revved at exactly 1800rpm like dan said and share a differant final drive ratio how can the crank possibly be spinning at the same speed? in the autos where the final drive is identical ive noted my claims and thats why i believe im right. There cant be any way possible i got 5 vn v6/v8's with inaccurate tacho's..
 

commsirac

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Im always open to suggestion and the way your putting it does make it sound feasible, im going by exactly what ive seen in my own personal cars, unless they had slipping transmissions, screwed tacho's or different diff gears im still sticking with my theory...

Unfortunately your theory appears based only on some assumptions rather than logic. If the pushbike example makes sense to you, as it should, then you should accept anything to the contrary as absurd.
If we put a v8 in the pushbike and it did 400rpm would it go any faster than if we put the v6 in the pushbike and maintained its speed to 400rpm.....of course not.


If the v6 and v8 t5 manuals revved at exactly 1800rpm like dan said and share a differant final drive ratio how can the crank possibly be spinning at the same speed? ..
Difficult to make much sense of this?
but if two engines are revving at 1800rpm then the crankshaft is rotating at that same speed in both engines. (there is no other way of putting it or interpreting it, rpm in engines is defined as revolutions of the crankshaft per minute)

So far no one else has lept to your defence in this aspect.....

Look, clearly you have a misconception going on here.......you really need to think it through some more.

Perhaps even get to the bottom of why your v8 and v6 show differnt rpm for the same road speed when you believe they have identical gearing.
What have you done to test that the gearing is the same? have you verified the diff ratios( I dont mean what is stamped on the build plate) do you know how to test the diff ratio? have you tested the drive shaft speed in overdrive?......and compared it to the crankshaft rpm?
Try this link Practical Problems In Mathematics ... - Google Book Search youll notice the questions dont need to say what size the motor is.

Anyway, it has got away from the point, a v8(an engine of larger capacity) will still use more fuel than a 6(smaller capacity) even on the highway cycle.....even if the gearing is made taller for the v8 so it can maintain a lower rpm than a v6.. Notice how Ive stressed the capacity, that's what its about.....not how many cylinders it has.

Which I have given you links to before, but Ill summarise again as you seem to have not taken it in:
its just not about the swept volume, its also about the throttle opening.

For a v8 to maintain 100km/h ~15kW of engine power is needed, and indeed it would be the same for the v6. Similar amounts of fuel are needed so similar amounts of air need to be drawn into the motor to react the fuel properly. With the same amount of air going it follows that the density of air in the larger motor will be less than the smaller motor. It also follows that on the compression stroke, the compression pressure in the bigger motor(dynamic compression) will be smaller since the cylinders are only partially filled .......efficiency is reduced.....result....larger motor needs slightly more fuel and air at light loads.

So yes,the v8 needs smaller throttle openings to provide the same load, which is commonly referred to by the novice as not working as hard. In fact it is working harder to achieve the same power output as it is burning more fuel

Ill leave it there, if some v8 owners want to believe something else, all I can say is ive given it my best shot.
 
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