maffless tunes

[ari666]

Yes mate I realize that is ideal custom tune (albeit redundant), but that is not what happens in a budget MAF tune...

actually, i think this comment is the most pertinant answer to OP's question.


OP if youre wondering why youre gonna pay that much for a proper dyno tune, its simply for this reason. its the amount of diagnosis and feedback that goes into your ECU that makes the difference.

a mailorder tune is basically just slamming a tune into your ECU that has worked on countless engine in the past and had *few* issues. its all preset stuff and assumes all your engine and sesors are 'in-spec' which more often than not ISNT the case.


a proper dyno tune will take a good couple of hours labour if everything is running perfect. youre paying the mechs' basic 80 bucks per hour, plus a helper at 80 bucks per hour, plus the cost of a dyno, and a GOOD dyno can run up to the $MIL, but average at say 2-$300,000, plus electricity, plus advertising etc.

in that time they will run through every single cell in every single table on your ECU, and take my word for it, there are a LOT of cells in a LOT of tables.

at the end of a dyno you drive away with a car running as efficiently as it possibly can, and as a result you get a sheet telling you they were able to make a fictional horsepower figure so you could show off to all your mates, plus in the meantime got a solid stable AFR and the engine didnt blow up.

 

[ConstantVelocity]

The VZ LS1s have a bigger (85mm) maf than the older ones, feeding into a 75mm throttle body. No real gain from removing it, and extra cost because you need to faf around fitting an external IAT sensor. A good mafless tune works very well, but on a stock car it's much of a muchness. Mafless on LS1s tends to go a bit lean on hot restarts when the IAT sensor is heatsoaked but it's no big deal because the fuel trims cover it.

$1200 for a tune on a stock LS1 is robbery, they will probably spend an hour on it tops, mostly copy paste if they've done a few before. On a VZ the stock spark maps are actually about right and the VE table is pretty good too. As long as the MAF is working properly all you really need to do is just adjust the power enrichment AFR to 12.6:1 or so (they're still too rich stock) and bob's your uncle...

 

[SS-REX]

After reading this thread my brain just exploded :undead: but thanks for the knowledge guys..

 

[Grennan]

A big part of MAFLess for the LS1 has also been the fact that not many of the OTRs have the room for one to be implemented. It wasnt untill quite recently anyone actually bothered to develop one with a MAF in mind.

Prices, you really get what you pay for. Typically a mail order goes for around 400-500. There used to be a changeover type deal not sure if thats still the case. Dyno Tunes, the price generally floats around 800-900 bucks.

Theres a few mail order ones going around, not as many as there used to be. But theres a guy on GumTree, he used to own LSX Performance here in Victoria who sells them for around the 500 dollar mark.

The difference between the two is fairly simple. There is a generic tune that places use, theyll have that tried and tested over countless vechiles. From there, they make some simple tweaks based on user preference and what mods you have. They throw it on the dyno and make any further tweaks based on the AFR and if they see any spikes in the reading.

Mail order tune ends at step one. They have a generic tune they have put on countless cars and it, for the most part, has been pretty stable. If youve got anything done to the car other than maybe an intake an cat back, youll want to avoid the mail order.

 

[Tysonf]

Hi guys is it safe to mafless tune ls1 thats done over 300000 kms

 

[Aus78Formula]

Nice thread-dig. KM are unrelated. If in good condition and well-serviced but high km, it will continue as so, albeit with somewhat more power, perhaps better economy. It's not like you are bolting a turbo onto a tired block or something that will quickly find how low the oil pressure is. It's just a computer tweak.