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Piston slap or hydraulic lifters?

Skylarking

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Piston Slap, some of you guys would hate to hear my AMG start up.

I keep the oil in the garage on the shelf next to it.
Wasn't there a known defect with cams or related components with the 6.3 ltr M156 V8 used in C63 AMG that makes the GM LS3 issue seem cheap in comparison :p

The M156 V8 seems like just another example of a defective engine with its own US class action.

https://www.jacobregarlaw.com/blog/2013/february/update-mercedes-benz-amg-class-action-for-the-m1/

If you read the link, there is some odd reasoning for the class action being dismissed… TSB not admission of defect? Such lawyering is probably why GM provides such **** customer support at times…

Or do you have the 4.0 ltr AMG V8?
 

panhead

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I have both the M156 6.2L V8 and the M177 Twin-Turbo 4.0L V8.

Head bolts were a problem on the M156 across the board and were quietly rectified

In the US there was a class action started in regard to the premature wear of cams and lifters (soft metal) but the plaintiffs didn’t continue with the court case.

The M177 is the better (read most reliable) of the C63 engines and is also fitted to the Aston Martins.

The next model of C63 will use a Plug-in Hybrid Turbocharged 4 Cylinder.

My point was the piston slap is built into the AMG engines and they are noisy on start up.

Having oil on hand is a must, particularly if you are using 0W-40 as originally recommended by AMG but I now use 5W-40 these days as AMG has changed it mind for cars in warmer climates and MB went through the vehicle and changed the tags to reflect the new oil recommendations.

When I lived in Sydney I could pull into the MB Service Department any time during business hours and they would top the oil up free of charge while you wait, it took about ten minutes.

Owners of new cars were also advised by MB to take advantage of this service during the break in period, without breaking out the owner's manual I think it is also mentioned as part of the routine maintenance of the vehicle.

Both the M156 and M177 use oil, AMG designed them that way, they also purge if you stop and start them.

I've had my neighbour ask me once why was there such a big cloud of smoke in the driveway when I started the M156 and it was just the engine doing it's job.

It will happen if I stop and start it a few times to move the car around the yard.






.
 

Skylarking

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Yeah I got what you were saying with piston slap on start up (you’ve said it before) but it also seems that there can be lots of clatter related to faulty cams &/or followers :rolleyes:

As far as piston slap is concerned, I wonder whether the Merc dealers warm them up prior to prospective purchasers doing their test drive like Holden seems to do :p

Also a little sad and odd that AMG engines produce big clouds of smoke on startup yet passed pollution laws… maybe lax test routines via regulatory capture at work :p

Morral of the story seems to be that poor quality NVH on startup isn’t uncommon but something possibly hidden by the sellers at purchase time via warming up the car up prior to a rest drive…

Seems misrepresentation lives everywhere and is as common as piston slap itself :p:p:p:p

At least Merc dealers have nice coffee and cakes on offer while you wait :cool:
 

Immortality

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Maybe the Merc motors probably do have forged pistons? They certainly make a bit more power than the LS3 and it's an engine designed to be abused (after all Clarkson loves his C63 and we know how he treats cars).
 

panhead

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Yeah I got what you were saying with piston slap on start up (you’ve said it before) but it also seems that there can be lots of clatter related to faulty cams &/or followers :rolleyes:

As far as piston slap is concerned, I wonder whether the Merc dealers warm them up prior to prospective purchasers doing their test drive like Holden seems to do :p

Also a little sad and odd that AMG engines produce big clouds of smoke on startup yet passed pollution laws… maybe lax test routines via regulatory capture at work :p

Morral of the story seems to be that poor quality NVH on startup isn’t uncommon but something possibly hidden by the sellers at purchase time via warming up the car up prior to a rest drive…

Seems misrepresentation lives everywhere and is as common as piston slap itself :p:p:p:p

At least Merc dealers have nice coffee and cakes on offer while you wait :cool:

They don't smoke as a general rule on start up, only when it self purges when the car has been started and stopped a few times in quick succession without travelling anywhere, it won't do it at all if the car has been sitting for a while.

The owner's manual explains why it does it.

If you are not someone like me who sometimes has to “Ay Steve, can you move the Camira? I need to get the Torana out to get to the Commodore.” “Sure thing Dad, but I'll have to get the keys to the Cortina if I'm gunna move that Camira.” then you may never notice it.

My old 2010 is Euro 6 compliant, Holden could have learnt a thing or two about emissions.

AMG do videos of their engine builds and talk about tolerances and why they design them the way they do, AMG engineers will also answer owner's questions up to a point through their exclusive forum, you need to produce your VIN and details for verification through the MB database before they will let you join.

The first AMG I owned was an E63 and the vehicle I tested was sitting on the showroom floor and it took about half an hour to move other cars then they pushed it to the entrance before they started it cold, there weren't any others sitting around as it was a 7 month wait for the ordered car to arrive.

My first listen of a C63 was also of a car sitting on the showroom floor, the bonnet was open and the engine was cold, the windows in the showroom at Parramatta rattled when it started and everyone turned.

I came back for a test the next day and was not allowed to throttle hard until the car's internal warning system said the oil had heated to operating temperature, those cars back then were in hot demand and it was a 9 month wait to get one from Germany and normally a two week wait for a test drive as they were sharing the few cars they had around the Sydney dealers.

I got a next day test drive because one, I was already an AMG owner with my E63 and two, I made it plain when I finished there I was going across the street to look at the new M3.

When I test drove of the 2019 car, the car was waiting for me outside and partially warm.

All these cars made a noise on start up but MB didn't shy away from it, if you wanted one that's what you got, once they warmed up they were fine.

You don't hear much when you are driving unless you kick it in the gut and then it's the roar of the exhaust, particularly from the E63 and 2010 C63.

So if you wanted to ask a question on how does a car meet regulations then the first question you would ask is how on earth does it get under the noise laws.




.
 

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Something drove past the house this evening that rattled the windows, I got a little excited :D:eek:
 

Ron Burgundy

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Found it… please note my issue ended up being lifters which eventually got replaced and NOT piston slap.
They don't smoke as a general rule on start up, only when it self purges when the car has been started and stopped a few times in quick succession without travelling anywhere, it won't do it at all if the car has been sitting for a while.

The owner's manual explains why it does it.

If you are not someone like me who sometimes has to “Ay Steve, can you move the Camira? I need to get the Torana out to get to the Commodore.” “Sure thing Dad, but I'll have to get the keys to the Cortina if I'm gunna move that Camira.” then you may never notice it.

My old 2010 is Euro 6 compliant, Holden could have learnt a thing or two about emissions.

AMG do videos of their engine builds and talk about tolerances and why they design them the way they do, AMG engineers will also answer owner's questions up to a point through their exclusive forum, you need to produce your VIN and details for verification through the MB database before they will let you join.

The first AMG I owned was an E63 and the vehicle I tested was sitting on the showroom floor and it took about half an hour to move other cars then they pushed it to the entrance before they started it cold, there weren't any others sitting around as it was a 7 month wait for the ordered car to arrive.

My first listen of a C63 was also of a car sitting on the showroom floor, the bonnet was open and the engine was cold, the windows in the showroom at Parramatta rattled when it started and everyone turned.

I came back for a test the next day and was not allowed to throttle hard until the car's internal warning system said the oil had heated to operating temperature, those cars back then were in hot demand and it was a 9 month wait to get one from Germany and normally a two week wait for a test drive as they were sharing the few cars they had around the Sydney dealers.

I got a next day test drive because one, I was already an AMG owner with my E63 and two, I made it plain when I finished there I was going across the street to look at the new M3.

When I test drove of the 2019 car, the car was waiting for me outside and partially warm.

All these cars made a noise on start up but MB didn't shy away from it, if you wanted one that's what you got, once they warmed up they were fine.

You don't hear much when you are driving unless you kick it in the gut and then it's the roar of the exhaust, particularly from the E63 and 2010 C63.

So if you wanted to ask a question on how does a car meet regulations then the first question you would ask is how on earth does it get under the noise laws.




.
I love the sound of V8 mercs. Just beautiful.

Over time what are you thoughts on MB service and support ?
 

panhead

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I love the sound of V8 mercs. Just beautiful.

Over time what are you thoughts on MB service and support ?

The service and support for all my MB's has always been and still is top notch and like HSV's at Holden dealerships, AMG owners go to the front of the queue and get special treatment.

They hands free wash and blow dry the cars to stop swirls, they have good food on offer as in hot and cold meals while you wait and not just coffee and biscuits, there is always a free loan car available and they are like for like though that isn't always the case as sometimes you get something a bit different when they're trying to sell you another car, you get a good explanation on any bulletin fixes or recall repairs that are outside the normal service, they try to sell you tyres and batteries at hugely inflated prices and they do a good job at pretending they like you.

The downside is you need to spend a lot of money to get that special treatment.

BMW do a half decent job as well but I sometimes get the feeling there that the staff feel they are more special than the customers, a mate of mine calls them the wannabes.




.
 

Ron Burgundy

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The service and support for all my MB's has always been and still is top notch and like HSV's at Holden dealerships, AMG owners go to the front of the queue and get special treatment.

They hands free wash and blow dry the cars to stop swirls, they have good food on offer as in hot and cold meals while you wait and not just coffee and biscuits, there is always a free loan car available and they are like for like though that isn't always the case as sometimes you get something a bit different when they're trying to sell you another car, you get a good explanation on any bulletin fixes or recall repairs that are outside the normal service, they try to sell you tyres and batteries at hugely inflated prices and they do a good job at pretending they like you.

The downside is you need to spend a lot of money to get that special treatment.

BMW do a half decent job as well but I sometimes get the feeling there that the staff feel they are more special than the customers, a mate of mine calls them the wannabes.




.

That's good to know. Cheers

Any Holden dealer I ever went to could not give a crap. They are okay when they try and sell you the car...as soon as you sign the contract, they could not care less...
 
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