Toyota is Gone. Goodbye Australian Car industry 1896-2017.

[SavVYute]

The second point, regarding utilisation of foreign labour, has validity, because so many Australian companies have ceased local production and utilise foreign plants to manufacture goods under well known Aussie brands. This applies particularly to clothing, for example, where you pay a typical Australian type price for a shirt made in China or India, so the profit margins are probably enormous.

I think you're on the money here Calaber

But why did the company go to an overseas firm in the first place? Probably because legislation and wage demands made local production uneconomical and the firm would not have survived if they had tried to stay in Australia.

You answered yourself it in your first paragraph I think. Domestically it's not always that we've priced ourselves out of the market. It's that you can import cheap stuff and make many times the profit.
You still make a profit selling Aussie made...just not as much.

 

[Grennan]

I have no idea what you are trying to prove here mpower.

We know that companies do this. Its no secret. We are saying our standard of living here is to high for these companies to remain profitable so they are forced to go to countries whos standard of living is lower and has a lower cost of labor.

What is the problem? Ethically, these people are getting paid peanuts, but peanuts to us may be millions to them. Who are we to say that they should be demanding more and more? Someone else is willing to take their spot because that is their culture.

A fair chunk of Australians now have an inbuilt sense of entitelment and quite frankly a low work ethic (I type his while Im at work haha). I do not blame companies for a second, shipping operations to Thailand or wherever.

Take the above example. A shirt costs lets say 50 dollars. Every year wages go up. There are excess costs involved, electricity etc. If the shirt goes up to cover those costs, the public no longer buys that shirt. So the company has a choice. Either raise the price to recoup costs. Absorbs costs from their profits. Look to where they can cut manufacturing costs.

 

[mpower]

I have no idea what you are trying to prove here mpower.

then you need to re-read the thread.

too many of us live in this first world bubble.

 

[Grennan]

then you need to re-read the thread.

too many of us live in this first world bubble.

Youre posting links saying that companies want to outsource to cheaper countries, often to countries without the working conditions of Australia and most certaintly without the workplace regulations.

Alert the presses! We know this. We arent denying this.

Are you trying to prove that companies are just looking out for themselves? Yes, first and foremost companies have an obligation to their shareholders to turn a profit.

If the Australian manufacturing industry has become so unprofitable then that is not "companies out to screw people" thats just a fact of life. Australia is expensive.

 

[Reaper]

Come one, get real.

5 second google

Australian Brands' Use Of Cheap Overseas Labour Has Investors Worried | Business Insider

Qantas outsources its labour | Courier Mail Vital Interest Blog

Telstra tipped to outsource another 1000 Australian jobs

Your last point, if you are already rich you can benefit from moving operations overseas as trade restrictions continue to fall exposing our local farmers, manufacturers etc to wages pressure from sweat shops and slave labour in india and asia. If you are a regular joe - you're stuffed quite frankly.

Foreign firms flock to China despite business risks - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

Ok - me being what some on here would consider the capitalist anti christ let me share a few things with you.

I have recently outsourced several jobs in my company to SE Asia and have imported people before on 457 Visas. Why outsource jobs? Regular occurrances in Australia:

1. guy arrives 15 min early for work, sits in the lunch room till 1min before start time, clocks on and then heads off to the rest rooms for a 20min dump
2. most stop work 5 min early for smoko/lunch and tend to drift back 5 min late nearly every day unless there is somebody there to crack the whip
3. For some reason they need to take a whole day off to take (insert some random relative here) to the airport for a late afternoon flight. Further this is often with little or no notice
4. Absenteeism on days surrounding public holidays are just crazy
5. Add the on costs for the multitude of additional costs of employment in Australia (eg payroll tax, superannuation, work cover, penalty rates etc etc etc) and employment costs in Australia are just un sustainable. The base hourly rate is usually not so bad, but when you add all the above it is often just not economic to do the job.

For my OS employees, none of #1 -4 are a problem what so ever. They no work, they no get paid or sacked thus mostly they are ultra reliable. As for #5 - actual costs are slightly less than the direct hourly wage in Aus without any of the on costs or hidden compliance costs etc.

As for 457 visas: Anybody who thinks it's an opportunity to import cheap labour doesn't know what they are talking about or kidding themselves

 

[mpower]

Ok - me being what some on here would consider the capitalist anti christ let me share a few things with you.

I have recently outsourced several jobs in my company to SE Asia and have imported people before on 457 Visas. Why outsource jobs? Regular occurrances in Australia:

1. guy arrives 15 min early for work, sits in the lunch room till 1min before start time, clocks on and then heads off to the rest rooms for a 20min dump
2. most stop work 5 min early for smoko/lunch and tend to drift back 5 min late nearly every day unless there is somebody there to crack the whip
3. For some reason they need to take a whole day off to take (insert some random relative here) to the airport for a late afternoon flight. Further this is often with little or no notice
4. Absenteeism on days surrounding public holidays are just crazy
5. Add the on costs for the multitude of additional costs of employment in Australia (eg payroll tax, superannuation, work cover, penalty rates etc etc etc) and employment costs in Australia are just un sustainable. The base hourly rate is usually not so bad, but when you add all the above it is often just not economic to do the job.

For my OS employees, none of #1 -4 are a problem what so ever. They no work, they no get paid or sacked thus mostly they are ultra reliable. As for #5 - actual costs are slightly less than the direct hourly wage in Aus without any of the on costs or hidden compliance costs etc.

As for 457 visas: Anybody who thinks it's an opportunity to import cheap labour doesn't know what they are talking about or kidding themselves

If someone told you you could pay them $10 a day tomorrow would you?

I'm not calling you a capitalist anti-christ if that's what you think either.

 

[Calaber]

Come one, get real.

5 second google

Australian Brands' Use Of Cheap Overseas Labour Has Investors Worried | Business Insider

Qantas outsources its labour | Courier Mail Vital Interest Blog

Telstra tipped to outsource another 1000 Australian jobs

Your last point, if you are already rich you can benefit from moving operations overseas as trade restrictions continue to fall exposing our local farmers, manufacturers etc to wages pressure from sweat shops and slave labour in india and asia. If you are a regular joe - you're stuffed quite frankly.

Foreign firms flock to China despite business risks - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

Get real?

What the hell do you think I said in the second paragraph? You gave examples of companies exporting jobs to cheaper labour supplies, which is precisely the point I made.

And plenty of "Joes" make the move, rich or not. Many of them actually start out with nothing and succeed overseas. Likewise, many migrants manage to do exactly the same thing here.

 

[Calaber]

I think you're on the money here Calaber



You answered yourself it in your first paragraph I think. Domestically it's not always that we've priced ourselves out of the market. It's that you can import cheap stuff and make many times the profit.
You still make a profit selling Aussie made...just not as much.

Savvy

Do you, like me, get a surprise when you buy an article of clothing that says it's Aussie made?

 

[Reaper]

If someone told you you could pay them $10 a day tomorrow would you?

Probably however I doubt I'd get the education level and experience for that rate. Most of these places are starting to wise up and although super cheap now, their wage growth is ramping up steam because they are seeing what the rest of the world's living standards are like. Expect the "cheap" labour to move to some of the more developing nations of SE asia and Africa later this decade. I'm starting to see more from South America too.

 

[devilly]

No one looks behind or in front for the next gen,learn from your mistakes and other people's,first mistake the Australian wool, booming industry why did it fail,because they thought how much $$$ they would make ,by sending our best sheep over seas,they didn't think of the next gen of sheep shearers, now to what i see from past to future,olden days the supermarket would pay someone to put the groceries in a paper bag, 2 workers per cash register ,now you have to buy your owe bags and have 1 worker, future would be you have to scan it and bag it yourself ,cheaper to hire a security guard to watch 3 checkouts then 1 worker per check out. so me making a stand for the next gen is i refuse to scan it and bag it, i will wait in line for as long as it takes,to help save that persons job.car industry has been also been done over by the new hoons laws ,and you cant have p's with a v8 e.t.c. In the future i see my self riding scooter and getting home delivery.