JCCC Federal Election Polls

[c2105026]

Whilst we may disagree on the appropriateness of the carbon tax, I do 100% concur that the rudd gillard govt has cocked more things up than its done right.

 

[Reaper]

Ahh yes typical right-wing scaremongering. Greens still want houses built but we could be doing more with recycled materials, or low-emissions materials.

Ahhhh yes. Those low emissions materials like the imported ones :idea:. That is the fundamental problem with this tax. It puts Australian manufacturing at a further disadvantage compared to the rest of the world. Imported = zero carbon tax. Australian made = Raped. Australian Coal powering Australia = tax. Australian Coal powering the world = free. Australian jobs competing against the world = KNEECAPPED BY OUR OWN GOVERNMENT!!!! You don't see a problem with that???

Take plantation timber - carbon negative (almost...).

I happen to know a bit about plantation timber. Go thru a semi load or 2 every week at my evil capitalistic company I run. One thing I have learned along the way is that it doesn't do much for a brick plant :bang:

We have enough sun and wind to power OZ completely, we just need some incentive to tap into it. It'll cost more than coal but its clean and non-polluting. To boot, coal power plants require huge amounts of water to operate; if climate change develops fully this may not be available.

Yet we send megalitres of treated water into the oceans every day. Build a pipline from the Carrum **** farm to the latrobe valley and said issues would be solved. Our last state government were sort of on the ball when they build the north-south pipeline except their direction was a little off - they went from one place with no water to another with less :bang:. East - West and it'd have worked a treat. Stupid lefties.

The housing affordability crisis was brought out 100% by pure greed and uber-low interest rates, tanks to mr howard. Job losses, probably, but there will be job gains as well.

Housing affordability for the most part is a function of supply/demand on available land near metropolitan areas running low (on the east coast capitals). Sydney just have no land whilst in Victoria the then (Labor) state government put in artificial urban boundaries to contain urban sprawl thus creating an artificial limits to supply.

Further to that, low interest rates usually mean better housing affordability not worse. You should be patting John Howard and Peter Costello on the back for such things.

Here's a tip - think about what you post - you are starting to sound even stupider than I first thought. :thumbsup:

Reaper

 

[c2105026]

1. Other countries are introducing carbon taxes (US, India, China etc.), some of which are more or less hard core than ours....don't worry. chill. the economy is not going to grind to a halt
2. Fully agree - our water management is up **** creek. This has happend irrespective of government in power.
3. Low interest rates stimulates housing prices. Because it happened so long under howard (i.e. low interest rates) everyone bought up, stimulating the housing bubble that has unfortunately (for first home buyers) not burst yet. I do agree, though, that perhaps varying governments have restricted urban sprawl, thereby creating shortage. The left is not perfect.
4. Of course i f**king know that plantation timber does not solve a brick plants woes (now ur just nitpicking) - just pointing out potential renewable alternatives that may/may not be appropriate given the project....

 

[Reaper]

1. Other countries are introducing carbon taxes (US, India, China etc.), some of which are more or less hard core than ours....don't worry. chill. the economy is not going to grind to a halt

Oh thank god...... oops sorry my bad...... Oh thank Bob! I feel so much better now :thumbsup: Seriously - the US are flat out not going broke, let alone getting any meaningful carbon tax thru Congress. From what I understand India and China's efforts are not worth the un-recycled, bleached paper they are written on.

2. Fully agree - our water management is up **** creek. This has happend irrespective of government in power.

Lol - where do I start....

3. Low interest rates stimulates housing prices. Because it happened so long under howard (i.e. low interest rates) everyone bought up, stimulating the housing bubble that has unfortunately (for first home buyers) not burst yet. I do agree, though, that perhaps varying governments have restricted urban sprawl, thereby creating shortage. The left is not perfect.

If the supply side was opened up somewhat the demand per house block would be lower thus you have less upward pressure on prices. Lower interest rates do allow more people to afford to buy a house but to me that is a good thing :hmmm:

4. Of course i f**king know that plantation timber does not solve a brick plants woes (now ur just nitpicking) - just pointing out potential renewable alternatives that may/may not be appropriate given the project....

The guy was talking about making bricks ffs. Why bring up timber???

Reaper

 

[c2105026]

Yeh water management - I live in a town where the last major infrastructure to be built was a dam in c.1962. The town was forecasted to be no larger than 30,000 in the year 2000. Well.....we are at 40,000 and have a large mine. Until last year I could not legally wash my car at home from jan. 2003. The time to have done something would have been the 1980s but apparently the council at the time were more concerned about being the orange-bathurst development centre than anything of tangible benefit.

Carbon tax was passed earlier this year in the US, legislation in china and india passed last year - yet to see if its done anything....true the asian ones are not as hard core as ours or americas. American system is that any facility that produces more than 100,000 tonnes of C02/yr needs to buy carbon permits (or something like that)

Now bricks...forecast price is set to rise by 6%. Bricks are cheap and heavy. Still not worthwhile to ship them in from overseas...

 

[Calaber]

All I can say is that to debate this issue with this bloke is like listening to Bob Brown all over again. It's obvious that Green disciples are as committed to the movement as its leader.

I can accept the right of the Greens to follow whatever beliefs float their boat, but the arguments agains the Jewish state are downright offensive and racist, nothing less. And no, I'm not Jewish. The bullshit that went on in Marrickville Council some weeks back, where they proposed to black ban all corporations that had dealings with Israel was, I thought, just a few moronic Green idiots making known publically how stupid they were. It appears they were not alone.

 

[Reaper]

Carbon tax was passed earlier this year in the US, legislation in china and india passed last year - yet to see if its done anything....true the asian ones are not as hard core as ours or americas. American system is that any facility that produces more than 100,000 tonnes of C02/yr needs to buy carbon permits (or something like that)

Well lets look at that.

USA: Well 3 of the 50 states have a Carbon tax of some sort. I guess it rounds up to a nation wide tax somehow :unsure:

India: Approx AUS$1 per ton of coal produced or burned in India. Kinda makes Australia's starting price of $23 a ton somewhat steep don't you think???

China: Well they have thought about it but nothing has been legislated yet. No figures are available.

And as the Prime Minister Brown or spokes woman Gillard refuse to answer - how much cooler will the world be as a result of the Australian Carbon Tax???? That is the end goal isn't it - to slow the world's temperature rise (which coincidentaly hasn't gone up in 6 years, well before the carbon tax stupidity came about).

Reaper

 

[c2105026]

All I can say is that to debate this issue with this bloke is like listening to Bob Brown all over again. It's obvious that Green disciples are as committed to the movement as its leader.

I can accept the right of the Greens to follow whatever beliefs float their boat, but the arguments agains the Jewish state are downright offensive and racist, nothing less. And no, I'm not Jewish. The bullshit that went on in Marrickville Council some weeks back, where they proposed to black ban all corporations that had dealings with Israel was, I thought, just a few moronic Green idiots making known publically how stupid they were. It appears they were not alone.

Fully agree re: marrackville council. Local government needs to confront local issues. Choose your battles. If anything is to be done about israel i.e. sanctions etc, it is a federal or even a UN issue. How is suggesting that Israel return to pre-1967 borders racist? For the record I am part jewish

 

[c2105026]

The carbon tax as it is won't solve the problem; granted. China, USA India, EU etc. need to come on board. It is about doing all we can, as a country, to solve a global problem. Even if we are unsuccessful, hopefully I can say to my yr 6 class of 2050 as we experience the very mild winter we could get - "Well, at least we tried".

 

[Calaber]

Hmmm, "your Year 6 in 2050".

How long do you intend working, then?

As for the Israeli issue, you made the comment that they had to go somewhere, as if to suggest they were a problem that should have just been shuffled off into a corner of the earth. I wasn't referring to re-alignment of the Jewish State boundaries; rather, I was expressing an opinion that your comment re Israel in general was racist, as if they didn't count for anything.

In relation to this country taking the steps it has to counter "Global Warming", "Carbon Reduction" or whatever you want to call it, why is it that your side of the argument always seems to be that we have to do something NOW, when other much larger polluters sit back and do zip? The examples you quote have been discredited any number of times because the manner and magnitude of their efforts are far less than isrepresented. Why do Gillard/Brown etc maintain that we will take a leading role in reducing GW, with only 22 million of the world's total population of 6-7 billion plus? Do they/you really believe that the world will take any notice of us? Not bloody likely.

We will provide them with some entertainment with our efforts though.