Boost.

[vnformula6]

Most of those vehicles only have intake/exhaust, higher boost and the diff ratio shortened. Exactly the same as so many other L67 owners.

I'm still doubting those figures.

Big call there you want to see my time slips?

Mine ran 6 12.9s in 1 night. No cam no intercooler. Would have gone 11s with easy if I did

 

[Pollushon]

All these L67 owners jumping on and justifying their choices reminds me of quite a few LS owner/posters. The point remains continually missed, it was never about which is better, it was about which is better cost vs. benefit. You don't need to be a subject matter expert to do the sums. But that's not a valid opinion it seems.

 

[Decicrate]

All these L67 owners jumping on and justifying their choices reminds me of quite a few LS owner/posters. The point remains continually missed, it was never about which is better, it was about which is better cost vs. benefit. You don't need to be a subject matter expert to do the sums. But that's not a valid opinion it seems.

And that is exactly what people have been trying to show you, but you seem blind to the facts.
Even when people have showed you that for the cost of a Raptor new, that you can get a L67 in to the 12's.
You how ever seem to think otherwise.
How many people would it take before you start to do the math correctly.

This thread is not about whats better, the whole thread was a question about a L67, go read the OP's post.

I answered the OP's question then the first post by you is calling me a liar!!!

Then I posted several examples of L67's in the 12's but this was not good enough, so you basically called me a liar again.
You don't even understand the simple concept of bolt on.

So just for you lets do the real easy math.

A Raptor pro street with inter cooler is $6400.00 (I have used the VT system as it shows the price with an inter cooler)
Now I that it that what you have?

So lets have a play with a L67.

1. L67 running $1800.00
2. Pulley upgrade $250.00
3. W2A intercooler $1800.00
4. High ratio rockers $650.00
5. Tune $1200.00

Total = $5700.00

So going by your cost V benefit, it would cost less to get into a 12 with a L67 than what it would with the Raptor, so there is no need for an opinion there is only the facts that need to be considered.
The fact is it is cheaper to get a L67 doing 12's on the 1/4 than the Raptor.

So if my math is wrong could you please show me where.

Now in saying that I do quite like the Raptors for what they are, they make good power in the top end and they are Australian made.

 

[Pollushon]

More walls of text, lol. You're a dedicated zealot. I never called you a liar about anything, I questioned your info and accepted your proof by word.

Op isn't doing his own work, you need to read properly, lots of folk don't, we're pretty rare. Conversion quote was $4k, sounds fair given labour, let's go $3k to help your cause. Kingy spent $5k with his own labour to get near a 12, says $1.5 on an intercooler will get him there. Best part of $10k there already bro not factoring any post conversion labour. That's maths from the real world BTW.

Airstrike said left nut or firstborn, now I can see why he bailed on this thread, I've sure learned my lesson, I'd rather thread up with LS posters.

 

[AirStrike]

meow ... i have a 204rwkw L67 getting 13.2sec .. not far off 12s ....... needs a better tune and gearbox re kitted should see me get those figures .

No offence, if I went to the trouble and expense of fitting a cam to make 200rwkw..............I would burn my car to the ground.

 

[Decicrate]

More walls of text, lol. You're a dedicated zealot. I never called you a liar about anything, I questioned your info and accepted your proof by word.

Op isn't doing his own work, you need to read properly, lots of folk don't, we're pretty rare. Conversion quote was $4k, sounds fair given labour, let's go $3k to help your cause. Kingy spent $5k with his own labour to get near a 12, says $1.5 on an intercooler will get him there. Best part of $10k there already bro not factoring any post conversion labour. That's maths from the real world BTW.

Airstrike said left nut or firstborn, now I can see why he bailed on this thread, I've sure learned my lesson, I'd rather thread up with LS posters.

I am a zealot, and very proud of it. After all being a fanatically committed person when it comes to my hobbies can only be a good thing and lead to better things.

After all you tend to learn a lot about things when you are committed, not just regurgitate other peoples ramblings.

Your words were, "Care to show us some? That's a misleading statement" there was nothing "misleading about it, again just because you have not a clue, it does not mean it is not true or correct. Then after giving you some proof your next statement was "Those cars you listed, some of them smell or run dangerous PSI I wouldn't recommend on a L67 daily. 203rwkw in a VY running 12's is one of the smelly ones even if it had 4.11's" so again even with proof you still want to disbelieve. Not only that you now want to tell us that we run to much boost, again you have no clue.
I really would like your expert opinion on what is too much boost for these tuned cars, and why!
Oh and 4.11's please bro, the highest that any of those L67's used was a 3.7, again the whole torque thing!!
I have to admit, I tried 3.9's in mine and they didn't last long, back to 3.45 so I can make the most of the TORQUE.
Like I said earlier look up what torque is then re read it so you may let it sink in. Then apply it to make a car move forward, then rethink how a power figure is not as important as a torque figure when getting said car moving.
If you understood that basic physics principal, you may just start to understand how a low HP car with a BIG FAT torque curve can beat a car with more power than it.


At the end of the day, show me 6 Raptor powered Commodores that are in the 12 second bracket with out having to open the engine to make any internal mods bar a rocker upgrade.
I think that's pretty fair as I have listed 6 L67's that have done it with not having to open the motor, just bolt on's, if you wish I could find you a hell of a lot more.

 

[Pollushon]

Mate I respect your passion, I've seen you post around the traps and I don't disagree you know your ****. But you no matter what I've said, you've continued to run off on a tangent that just isn't there. I've reiterated that I'm talking a cost vs. benefit basis, so sorry but I'll disagree til I'm blue in the face your comment was misleading because it's a $10k+ affair for the OP any which way you look at it to build the car your talking about.

I told you I stand corrected on the 12 second L67's you listed, what more do you want? Kiddo just walks away daring to question you? Dafuq? Is it because I have the word Raptor in my signature? You keep harping on about the same crap trying to chip away at my intellect and understanding of torque (not to be confused with not having a comprehensive understanding of the L67) like some 5 year old because you've got no comeback to the actual argument I presented. Walls of text, snippets and snide remarks about things I didn't say, for example; nowhere did I write that I ran a 13. I pointed you to the identical VS my kit came from. I state this clearly in my vehicle thread, openly and transparently, which you obviously read, yet still, you attack.

Like I said, I respect your passion but not your blindness. This thread is a real shame, not just for the OP, but for V6 FI. Dunno about you, but I'm fluffing embarrassed.

 

[Cava454]

No offence, if I went to the trouble and expense of fitting a cam to make 200rwkw..............I would burn my car to the ground.

Quotes for lol's.

 

[Decicrate]

Mate I respect your passion, I've seen you post around the traps and I don't disagree you know your ****. But you no matter what I've said, you've continued to run off on a tangent that just isn't there. I've reiterated that I'm talking a cost vs. benefit basis, so sorry but I'll disagree til I'm blue in the face your comment was misleading because it's a $10k+ affair for the OP any which way you look at it to build the car your talking about.

I told you I stand corrected on the 12 second L67's you listed, what more do you want? Kiddo just walks away daring to question you? Dafuq? Is it because I have the word Raptor in my signature? You keep harping on about the same crap trying to chip away at my intellect and understanding of torque (not to be confused with not having a comprehensive understanding of the L67) like some 5 year old because you've got no comeback to the actual argument I presented. Walls of text, snippets and snide remarks about things I didn't say, for example; nowhere did I write that I ran a 13. I pointed you to the identical VS my kit came from. I state this clearly in my vehicle thread, openly and transparently, which you obviously read, yet still, you attack.

Like I said, I respect your passion but not your blindness. This thread is a real shame, not just for the OP, but for V6 FI. Dunno about you, but I'm fluffing embarrassed.

No where have I run off tangent the whole thread is about a question about a L67 and that is what I have been discussing.
You are well within your rights to disagree with me. No biggie at all.
No where did I bring up costs at all in the beginning, it was others that started the whole its going to cost you money if you want to go fast, not me, I only made a statement about it is relative to how fast you want to go.
I made a simple but true statement that with good bolt ons and a tune you can get a L67 in to the 12's.

Then you lost the plot, calling me out for such blasphemy so then you were given the proof. Still you called me out, that's nice don't mind being made out to be telling porkie pies.
then there was this Be a horses arse, fanboi all you want mate. But people bolt Raptors on and the walk away, simple. That's the beauty of them. If I spent the dollars they would have on opening their engines up, then I'd be competing with Airstrike, but my kit ran 13 flat on a stock untouched engine, a TRUE bolt on.

Again in your BLINDNESS you missed the whole unopened bit, but that's ok.

Then there is this stroking your own lopsided ego how i do love to stroke!!

And somewhere amongst this is your argument??

I really don't know why some of you guys think that I am anti Raptor, I have said it before and I will say it again, I think the Raptors are pretty dam cool!!
But when you try to compare them to a PD blower, it like saying that acids and alkaline are the same because they will burn the **** out of you.
You really can not compare the two and this is part of the point.

A Raptor on a standard ecotec will make more power than a L67 at the same boost if both are cooled.
The difference is that the Raptor will not win the race over the 1/4 even with more power, this comes back to the whole torque thing. And this is the main point. When you are producing boost at 1500rpm the torque curve that you can generate is pretty cool and this is what gets the car going.

I did not read your whole thread, just grabbed the mods info, so when you said in this thread that your kit ran a flat 13, I believed it until it was pointed out to me that you had not run the car.
When people say "my kit" I would presume that they were referring to their car.

I think this thread has been a blast, not a shame at all, after all we have come to several important conclusions.

1. I don't hate Raptors
2. You can get L67's in to the 12 second bracket with bolt ons and a tune.
3. A Raptor with an inter cooler is worth $6400.00
4. Torque is what get you going, the more torque the better.
5. If you want really big power, go turbo
6. There are more L67's with simple bolt ons and tunes in the 12's than there are Raptors.
7. Raptors are proudly made in QLD!!!!!
8. There are other forums that have other cars that are Commodores besides Just Commodores.
9. I really love to stroke my ego!
10. I am a zealot!
11. I do not get embarrassed as easily as others

 

[Husky]

Well this got out if hand. I have zero interest in 1/4 times, I drive a wagon FFS. I only want an L67 for a project, and all I would add would be a diff and a shift kit on top of the CAI I already have, and maybe more PSI and rocker because I can fit them myself. So no, I won't be spending 10 grand.

Besides, are after market superchargers even legal? I want a daily, not a drag car. I would be wrapped with 200kw.