Front springs lower than SSL?

[Immortality]

I did read the whole thing.....


I still don't agree that a SSL spring is "softer" than a standard spring especially on a standard non-progressive rate spring. One a progressive rate coil one end is softer but it's compressed as soon as the car is lowered to it's ride height (have a look under you car at the suspension strut and the top couple of coils will already be sitting atop one another) Once the vehicle is sitting at it's normal ride height (for the SSL spring) the spring rate from that point onwards will be harder, if it wasn't then the spring wouldn't be able to arrest the vehicle weight (with the reduced suspension travel) when it hit's a bump and the suspension would bottom out.

Not all lowered springs are progressive rate, in fact not many are, even factory fitted springs generally aren't progressive rate springs. Generally to increase spring rates, you can increase the coil diameter (but is usually limited to vehicle specifications) or the coil wire diameter and/or the number of coils. The quality of the steel used is also an influence, this we agree up on.

Free length doesn't confuse people, it's important because when suspension is at maximum extension the spring must remain captured, this is critical for the safe performance of said suspension.

I'm not trying to confuse anybody. But trying to simplify a statement with info that is somewhat miss-leading is wrong. That's how Internet folklore is born.

 

[yxyx64]

.....


I still don't agree that a SSL spring is "softer" than a standard spring especially on a standard non-progressive rate spring. One a progressive rate coil one end is softer but it's compressed as soon as the car is lowered to it's ride height (have a look under you car at the suspension strut and the top couple of coils will already be sitting atop one another) Once the vehicle is sitting at it's normal ride height (for the SSL spring) the spring rate from that point onwards will be harder, if it wasn't then the spring wouldn't be able to arrest the vehicle weight (with the reduced suspension travel) when it hit's a bump and the suspension would bottom out.........

yep...somehow I think we are both saying the same thing.......soft first.....so compresses to lower ride height..... then hard but not much travel left.

gotta get back to helping the people from over the seas - eh bro

 

[Immortality]

Softer doesn't explain a linear rate SSL spring when compared to the standard spring...... which is not to be confused with a progressive rate spring. Not quiet the same at all unfortunately.

 

[yxyx64]

facts to help the OP understand which front springs for his holden are progressive rate:

King 47sl
king 47ssl
holden fe2 (example is 92044139)

These 3 springs are within 29mm (typo previous of 9mm - now corrected) of each other for free-length.

For info a king 47hd is also progressive and the same free-length.

Progressive rate springs are the type of spring that are soft, compress down to ride height, then increasingly harder for the remaining travel. That is what progressive rate means. The lower the normal height of the spring then the softer at the start, and also the harder at the end. This applies to the king 47ssl.

Progressive rate lowered springs are made by ozzie companies for the commodore. They are readily available. They are the usual type of commodore front spring you buy in aussie. You would need to put some effort into searching out a supplier to obtain anything other than a progressive rate lowered front commodore spring in aussie,

But to answer OP lower than ultra will mean changes and $$$: Tubular Suspension 02-9487 4248 for bags

 

[DJ_Cosmic_Fire]

Hey Guys,

Wanting to know if King Springs go any lower than SSL at the FRONT for VT commo v6? Really needing the front lower on my car but can't seem to find any lower than SSL.
If they don't exist, what do people know about getting springs professionally "compressed'' ?

Thanks in advance

Being that your in SE QLD, Call Chris at Performance Suspension in Labrador, he is a top bloke & will guide you through "Live" as opposed to an online forum. I'd say XYZ Coilovers are what you will need/like

 

[Immortality]

facts to help the OP understand which front springs for his holden are progressive rate:

King 47sl
king 47ssl
holden fe2 (example is 92044139)

These 3 springs are within 9mm of each other for free-length.

For info a king 47hd is also progressive and the same free-length.

Progressive rate springs are the type of spring that are soft, compress down to ride height, then increasingly harder for the remaining travel. That is what progressive rate means. The lower the normal height of the spring then the softer at the start, and also the harder at the end. This applies to the king 47ssl.

Progressive rate lowered springs are made by ozzie companies for the commodore. They are readily available. They are the usual type of commodore front spring you buy in aussie. You would need to put some effort into searching out a supplier to obtain anything other than a progressive rate lowered front commodore spring in aussie,

But to answer OP lower than ultra will mean changes and $$$: Tubular Suspension 02-9487 4248 for bags

That's nice, I note that your comparing lowered King springs next to the factory lowered FE2 spring which is almost identical in ride height to the SL spring to begin with and already about 25-30mm lower than the factory standard height springs........

Front springs almost need to be a progressive rate type spring because you can't get an off the shelf shortened front strut which means the spring would not be properly captured at max extension........

Last time I lowered a Commodore, we used a set of spring compressors on the front springs because even with the strut at full extension there is still a lot of pressure on the standard height spring, when the new lowered spring was fitted the spring compressor was not required because the spring was only just captured when the strut top was re-fitted that clearly shows that there is more than a few millimetres difference between the free length of the springs........

Why don't you compare some rear springs which are generally a true linear rate spring.....

If you don't like what I have to say, that's fine but don't PM me to try and shut me up :thumbsup:

Also King do a SSSL spring, however they are only recommended for show car etc

 

[yxyx64]

length typo fixed above (29 not 9 is free length difference :doh

went and measured a factory V6 standard spring

standard vr-Vs spring Holden part 92024713. Exactly the same free-length as holden fe2 spring, but fe2 ends up 30mm lower when fitted on the same car.

The 47sl are 26mm shorter than std in free length but end up as 50mm lower when installed.

The 47ssl are 29mm shorter but end up as 65 to 70mm lower when installed on a car.

The point here is that free-length does not make as much difference to the satic height of a spring on a car as does the spring rate. But of course it is one factor.

Short front struts are readily available in aussie and are a very good idea - as in you are silly not to fit with supers or ultra springs.

Alll of these springs are 6 coil springs and have the same ends.

Not sure why anything rear spring suddenly got involved. OP wants front. Maybe start a new thread if you want information on rear springs.

 

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

The strut traps the spring anyway, so a shortened front strut isn't absolutely necessary. The spring will bind up before the strut bottoms out, and the only risk is unseating the spring if you get airborne.

 

[yxyx64]

agree when $ tight but short struts are not just a length thing - the damping rates are different.

 

[ephect]

Short struts are all about keeping the correct operating range for dampening with the new height