GM.com - Warning of what to expect now under ACL Warranty now Holden is gone.

[Skylarking]

Magistrate won't be concerned with ''others'' having similar problems = Holden will discount that approach saying that they're not in court to discuss what might or might not be causing a noise in another persons vehicle.

Hearsay isn’t something one can push in court... but he who judges such things may be interested in any other small claim court cases and the determinations for similar issues to OP’s.

The NZ case comes to mind as NZ consumer laws are rather similar to ours down under and they found one LS3 was too noisy and ordered a full purchase price refund It’s harder for Holden/GM to argue another judges determination on a noisy LS3 isn’t relevant when the reasoning for the judgement can be provided for the magistrates examination and evaluation...

 

[mpower]

Hearsay isn’t something one can push in court... but he who judges such things may be interested in any other small claim court cases and the determinations for similar issues to OP’s.

The NZ case comes to mind as NZ consumer laws are rather similar to ours down under and they found one LS3 was too noisy and ordered a full purchase price refund It’s harder for Holden/GM to argue another judges determination on a noisy LS3 isn’t relevant when the reasoning for the judgement can be provided for the magistrates examination and evaluation...

the correct course is to build the case in the same manner to attempt to get the same result, not to use another case as leverage.

 

[Skylarking]

the correct course is to build the case in the same manner to attempt to get the same result, not to use another case as leverage.

Yes that’s obvious that one need to actually build their case, which is why you’d need the engine striped down and expert testimony presented to the judge... But once that has all been presented, if there is a prior case that you can reference to show that the reasoning and arguments you’ve put forward were considered valid in another jurisdiction you’d be crazy not to do such as and may help seal the deal...

If one simply turns up and presents a video and a prior ruling, that would not counter GM/Holden’s arguments that the engine isn’t suffering any damage from the noise... having an expert show how and why the noise occurs (cylinders and pistons worn out due to poor manufacture/design) very much counters the argument and the case reference shows that such arguments have been accepted in other jurisdictions... Much more likely to get a good outcome that way

Really, GM/Holden already know these facts and are just hoping the owners won’t go to the trouble and cost to call them out in court.... such should result in coast being awarded due to their unclean hands.....

It’s just a pity there isn't an element of punitive damages that can be awarded with ACL claims to stamp out such shitfuckery

 

[mpower]

Yes that’s obvious that one need to actually build their case, which is why you’d need the engine striped down and expert testimony presented to the judge... But once that has all been presented, if there is a prior case that you can reference to show that the reasoning and arguments you’ve put forward were considered valid in another jurisdiction you’d be crazy not to do such as and may help seal the deal...

If one simply turns up and presents a video and a prior ruling, that would not counter GM/Holden’s arguments that the engine isn’t suffering any damage from the noise... having an expert show how and why the noise occurs (cylinders and pistons worn out due to poor manufacture/design) very much counters the argument and the case reference shows that such arguments have been accepted in other jurisdictions... Much more likely to get a good outcome that way

Really, GM/Holden already know these facts and are just hoping the owners won’t go to the trouble and cost to call them out in court.... such should result in coast being awarded due to their unclean hands.....

It’s just a pity there isn't an element of punitive damages that can be awarded with ACL claims to stamp out such shitfuckery

that's what class action lawsuits are for.

 

[Skylarking]

that's what class action lawsuits are for.

Ideally I‘d have wanted it written into ACL that if a company is being unreasonably obstructive with known issues that they pay not only investigation and expert witness costs but also a reasonable hourly rate for the consumer to chase the dealer/manufacturer for a fix and the many many hours to prepare his case for the courts... otherwise it’s all just a numbers game for the dealer and manufacturer as many simply give up...

Class action lawsuits are just for the lawyers to win big.... the harmed individuals aren’t really helped much by them...

 

[VCoz]

Minor UPDATE, before I post another video being prepared (Part 1a pre proposed Part 2 legals). GM Holden Customer Care have again demonstrated their true 'self' and that Care is a facade I am responding appropriately.
GM rhetoric and assurances - to 'Honour all existing warranties and guarantees' - to 'Provide servicing and spare parts for at least 10 years, through national aftersales networks in Australia and New Zealand' is not what I am experiencing.
Re my vehicles 'FAULTY LS3 ENGINE' that is under FULL FACTORY WARRANTY (5 year or 130,000Km ending 15 August 2021 ).
Note: The Holden Dealer determined the need for and sought a new engine - GM Australia denied repair authorization (initially without GM Australia inspection). GM Australia wrote: ' we do accept reports from Dealerships just not 3rd party repairers'.
To date the opinions of all LS3 performance engine builders contacted is their engines don't make the noises GM claim are Normal, by Design, Characteristic (this is a complex legal area in practice most people like I was would be unaware about). Interesting that GM hold no LS3 engines for replacements, they have been gone from spare parts for a long time - so much for GM Australia assurances to holding spare parts for 10 years.
RACQ inspection recommendation was 'not to drive my vehicle' (this vehicle is our only transport ); so I asked the selling dealer Zupps Service Manager what do I do? Appears up to me but no point in a dealer looking at it as Service Manager said "if GM Holden say there is no noise there is no noise" (my next video will demonstrate 'that' abnormal noise that GM claim does not exist) - ACL warranty made simple under GM Australia. GM self review: 'GM Australia is very aware of our obligations under the Consumer Guarantee provisions of the Australian Consumer Law and maintain that at all times we have complied with our obligations in relations to this matter at the highest level possible. Given the above we believe your vehicle is of acceptable quality and is fit for purpose as we have no evidence to suggest otherwise.'
Following includes part of GM Australia's 'technical explanation' that explains GM Holden's evaluation of my engines 'noise' - GM Australia states 'Please note all commercially sensitive information has been redacted from the attached files'. I repeat apparently the information redacted below demonstrates 'there is no justification for engine replacement' this and the tens of pages like it I had to wait for months to be given.
HCC are again delaying further information they have control over - I have widened my complaints an engine builder said to "just take it to the dealer, jump up and down and say I won't my engine fixed". It's NOT that easy under GM Australia rule.'

 

[Immortality]

The redaction in the files is a clear demonstration they aren't telling the full truth. The sooner you go to court the better it will be as the court will need to consider all information including anything they refuse to show you.

There are articles online about the NZ case, track them down and present it as evidence in your case.

 

[stooge]

Minor UPDATE, before I post another video being prepared (Part 1a pre proposed Part 2 legals). GM Holden Customer Care have again demonstrated their true 'self' and that Care is a facade I am responding appropriately.
GM rhetoric and assurances - to 'Honour all existing warranties and guarantees' - to 'Provide servicing and spare parts for at least 10 years, through national aftersales networks in Australia and New Zealand' is not what I am experiencing.
Re my vehicles 'FAULTY LS3 ENGINE' that is under FULL FACTORY WARRANTY (5 year or 130,000Km ending 15 August 2021 ).
Note: The Holden Dealer determined the need for and sought a new engine - GM Australia denied repair authorization (initially without GM Australia inspection). GM Australia wrote: ' we do accept reports from Dealerships just not 3rd party repairers'.
To date the opinions of all LS3 performance engine builders contacted is their engines don't make the noises GM claim are Normal, by Design, Characteristic (this is a complex legal area in practice most people like I was would be unaware about). Interesting that GM hold no LS3 engines for replacements, they have been gone from spare parts for a long time - so much for GM Australia assurances to holding spare parts for 10 years.
RACQ inspection recommendation was 'not to drive my vehicle' (this vehicle is our only transport ); so I asked the selling dealer Zupps Service Manager what do I do? Appears up to me but no point in a dealer looking at it as Service Manager said "if GM Holden say there is no noise there is no noise" (my next video will demonstrate 'that' abnormal noise that GM claim does not exist) - ACL warranty made simple under GM Australia. GM self review: 'GM Australia is very aware of our obligations under the Consumer Guarantee provisions of the Australian Consumer Law and maintain that at all times we have complied with our obligations in relations to this matter at the highest level possible. Given the above we believe your vehicle is of acceptable quality and is fit for purpose as we have no evidence to suggest otherwise.'
Following includes part of GM Australia's 'technical explanation' that explains GM Holden's evaluation of my engines 'noise' - GM Australia states 'Please note all commercially sensitive information has been redacted from the attached files'. I repeat apparently the information redacted below demonstrates 'there is no justification for engine replacement' this and the tens of pages like it I had to wait for months to be given.
HCC are again delaying further information they have control over - I have widened my complaints an engine builder said to "just take it to the dealer, jump up and down and say I won't my engine fixed". It's NOT that easy under GM Australia rule.'

you have a lawyer fighting gm directly for you and that lawyer should be getting non redacted information, you are going to pay him/her a fair amount to fix this so make sure he/she is doing their job properly and try not to stress too much because it is the lawyers job to talk to gm and deal with them, that is what you are paying them for.

 

[mpower]

The redaction in the files is a clear demonstration they aren't telling the full truth. The sooner you go to court the better it will be as the court will need to consider all information including anything they refuse to show you.

There are articles online about the NZ case, track them down and present it as evidence in your case.

agree, quit faffing about and just take it to court already.

 

[VS 5.0]

Whole page redacted lol.