The VE Monaro

[BANKS]

It's true that the sales of V8's rose with the advent of the VE, but that was in 2006, before the current fuel price issue. No doubt, sales of large engines continue, but my point was that this won't last forever. I have to admit that I am amazed at the actions being taken by HSV and Ford to release even larger and more powerful V8's than we have at present. When is enough power enough. (Now, no doubt, some will respond to this question with the answer "There is never enough power!" but there has to be an end somewhere.

It is not just the price of fuel that will kill off our big engines. Government interference like took place in 1973, that killed off the V8 Torana, GTHO Phase IV and hi-po 340 Chargers,will happen again. Manufacturers will be told that they have reached their zenith with the power race. And the market will realise that there just isn't any sensible reason for manufacturing such powerful vehicles for street use.

I've had my share of 327 and 350 HT and HG Munro's back in the 70's. I have a photo of my 327 HT Premier sitting beneath a petrol price sign that reads "Standard 15.4 (cents per litre). Super was 15.7 cpl. Shortly after that photo was taken, the price of fuel took off and within 12 months, it had risen by about 8 cents per litre. V8's couldn't be given away - it took me five months to sell mine and I took a bath on the selling price. It's ok to say that today's eights are far more economical, and they are, but 12 to 15 litres per 100 k's will not cut it when our prices reach European levels, the market for big engines drops, taxation levees are introduced on engines over a certain size and fuel economy really starts to matter. There will always be those who don't care about fuel economy but if their numbers fall to the point where it is no longer economical to manufacture V8's, manufacturers will stop offering them.

+1 good call!

 

[1991_Vn2nV]

It's true that the sales of V8's rose with the advent of the VE, but that was in 2006, before the current fuel price issue. No doubt, sales of large engines continue, but my point was that this won't last forever. I have to admit that I am amazed at the actions being taken by HSV and Ford to release even larger and more powerful V8's than we have at present. When is enough power enough. (Now, no doubt, some will respond to this question with the answer "There is never enough power!" but there has to be an end somewhere.

I think you forget that the price of fuel has actually been fairly consistent over the last 2 years now.

The VE was released in August 2006. Cruide Oil first hit $100 AU a barrel 2 months before the VE was released, around June 2006. It is currently sitting at around the same price, $100-$110 AU a barrel.

 

[CSP]

It's true that the sales of V8's rose with the advent of the VE, but that was in 2006, before the current fuel price issue. No doubt, sales of large engines continue, but my point was that this won't last forever. I have to admit that I am amazed at the actions being taken by HSV and Ford to release even larger and more powerful V8's than we have at present. When is enough power enough. (Now, no doubt, some will respond to this question with the answer "There is never enough power!" but there has to be an end somewhere.

It is not just the price of fuel that will kill off our big engines. Government interference like took place in 1973, that killed off the V8 Torana, GTHO Phase IV and hi-po 340 Chargers,will happen again. Manufacturers will be told that they have reached their zenith with the power race. And the market will realise that there just isn't any sensible reason for manufacturing such powerful vehicles for street use.

I've had my share of 327 and 350 HT and HG Munro's back in the 70's. I have a photo of my 327 HT Premier sitting beneath a petrol price sign that reads "Standard 15.4 (cents per litre). Super was 15.7 cpl. Shortly after that photo was taken, the price of fuel took off and within 12 months, it had risen by about 8 cents per litre. V8's couldn't be given away - it took me five months to sell mine and I took a bath on the selling price. It's ok to say that today's eights are far more economical, and they are, but 12 to 15 litres per 100 k's will not cut it when our prices reach European levels, the market for big engines drops, taxation levees are introduced on engines over a certain size and fuel economy really starts to matter. There will always be those who don't care about fuel economy but if their numbers fall to the point where it is no longer economical to manufacture V8's, manufacturers will stop offering them.

Adjusted for inflation, fuel is STILL cheaper than it's ever been. Back in the late 70's / early 80's my Dad built a 4 bedroom house with ensuite and double garage on a 1500 square metre block for $38,000!!!

Ford and Holden keep building bigger engines because people want them!!! Enough said.

 

[minux]

A Victorian study by Steve Bracks has concluded that it is not worth pursuing a future in smaller cars. Victorians do not want them, they like their larger cars even with the price of fuel. Most people who whinge about fuel are 4WD owners and small - mid size car owners.

Fact is, the large car is here to stay for a long time....well in Victoria anyway

 

[simon.w]

There is certainly a place for turbo diesels. 4WD's for example.... which is why I am bewildered that things such as the H3 Hummer, Mazda CX7 and CX9, Ford Territory are not available as oil burners with snails. It's thses things, using underpowered petrol engines pushing heavy, wind resistant bodies that get the worst fuel economy.

I was interested in a CX7, until I started researching the figures.... an average of 17litres per hundred. It was then that I came to my senses and realised, that if I'm going to get back fuel economy, then I may as well have some fun.... and the SSV was ordered.

As for VE with turbo diesel.... it could only be justified if it opened up new European markets.... Aussies like big engines that rev to 6000 and beyond.

TD's are a completely different driving experience.... fine for off road.... but not so much fun for day to day driving.

 

[BANKS]

As for VE with turbo diesel.... it could only be justified if it opened up new European markets.... Aussies like big engines that rev to 6000 and beyond.

TD's are a completely different driving experience.... fine for off road.... but not so much fun for day to day driving.

I think a VE TD would do well in both the aussie and european markets. Go up agasint the likes of the ford mondeo or even the bmw 5 series.

 

[Calaber]

Adjusted for inflation, fuel is STILL cheaper than it's ever been. Back in the late 70's / early 80's my Dad built a 4 bedroom house with ensuite and double garage on a 1500 square metre block for $38,000!!!

Ford and Holden keep building bigger engines because people want them!!! Enough said.

It doesn't matter if it's "comparitively" cheaper or not - the bloody stuff is running out!

In the 1970's and 80's, China and India didn't count for much on world demand for oil. Now, the world's two largest populations are becoming more and more mechanised, and car sales in both countries are rising dramatically. There simply isn't the output from the world's oil suppliers to keep up with demand.

One day, soon, Ford and Holden will get severely bitten on the arse because they no longer offer the cars Australians want. Holden really only floats on its exports these days, if they relied on local sales of Commodores, they;d be in trouble. For Ford, I see nothing but problems unless they can export the FG.

How can you explain the fact that the Corolla is now the top selling car in Australia? I hate the bloody things, but more Australians want them for their private cars than Holdens.

As I said in my earlier post, one day, so few people will want V8's that they will be killed off. Fullstop. Enjoy them while you can.

 

[vicarious]

How can you explain the fact that the Corolla is now the top selling car in Australia? I hate the bloody things, but more Australians want them for their private cars than Holdens.

there is no way i can ever fit confortably in a small car the size of the corolla(im tall), you would think people are getting taller/fatter they couldn't get in them

 

[CSP]

How can you explain the fact that the Corolla is now the top selling car in Australia? I hate the bloody things, but more Australians want them for their private cars than Holdens.

Fleet sales... Over the last three months, yes the Corolla has been the number 1 selling car. However this is due directly to fleets downsizing the size of their fleet vehicles.

I know for a fact that Commodore company cars are changing to Astras and Corollas at the moment. Government especially...

 

[Calaber]

Those fleet sales used to go to Commodores and Falcons, but government departments and private companies are just as interested in keeping operating costs down as most private buyers. It all spells bad news for thumping eights and large capacity sixes. In 1984 Holden nearly ceased V8 production and it was a magazined campaign that promoted "V8's till 98" that helped to keep them alive. I reckon the last ten years have been a bit of a bonus for eight freaks and the engines today are certainly better than the dogs that were being served up to run on unleaded in the early 80's.

There are a few ways that eights can survive, but none of them involve unleaded. The most obvious is LPG, but the power losses and other operating problems mitigate against that fuel, I think.

The second is smaller eights, with multi camshafts and hi-tech engine managment. Pushrod eights will go because they cannot deliver the same volumetric efficiency of multi-cam, variable valve timing and reduced friction of smaller and lighter motors.
The third is the diesel.

And after reading all the last page or so of posts, hasn't this one moved off topic - it started out debating the appearance of the two door VE!