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VE commodore laps the ring in 8:30

immortality

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was just reading that a VE commodore in pontiac GTO guise with a rolcage lapped the "ring" in 8minutes and 30 seconds. thats only 2 seconds slower then a BMW e49 M5. a car that costs 3 times more the the VE.

one must wonder what a E series HSV would do, especially a W427 (which is still substancially cheaper then the BMW)
 

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was just reading that a VE commodore in pontiac GTO guise with a rolcage lapped the "ring" in 8minutes and 30 seconds. thats only 2 seconds slower then a BMW e49 M5. a car that costs 3 times more the the VE.

one must wonder what a E series HSV would do, especially a W427 (which is still substancially cheaper then the BMW)
GTO or G8? The GTO was based on the Aus Monaro which ceased production several years go.

Doubt the E series would be much faster - the G8 gets a motor much closer to the HSV spec here. Brakes would be somewhat better on the HSV though.

Reaper
 

immortality

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yeah, sorry G8 model. still not bad for a commodore either way
 

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lol, rollcage? Fair bit of help in stiffening the car and then comparing it to a car that is now over 6 years old(I am presuming you mean the E39?) :rofl: Seriously, that is GM holding onto something that isn't there.

The E60 M5(80k USD) lapped in 8:13 in off the street trim. The GXP(38k USD) that lapped was a development mule, so who can ever trust the figures?
Regardless, I would much rather a beautifully crafted euro machine than some slapped together Australian car, lets see a time in off the street trim, no doubt it would be closer to the 9 minute mark.
 
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immortality

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so you drive a "slapped together" aussie car. why not sell it and get some Euro trash then that you always seem to rave about.
 

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so you drive a "slapped together" aussie car. why not sell it and get some Euro trash then that you always seem to rave about.
I do drive a slapped together Aussie car, I wont buy euro( I only want an M5) until I can pay cash for it, no way in hell i am financing any car I own.

No need to get so defensive though, I know you love your Commodores, seriously though, calling cars "euro trash" just shows how you think.
 

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I do drive a slapped together Aussie car, I wont buy euro( I only want an M5) until I can pay cash for it, no way in hell i am financing any car I own.

No need to get so defensive though, I know you love your Commodores, seriously though, calling cars "euro trash" just shows how you think.
Yeah I was gonna say, the euro trash part is a tad bit ignorant, considering the Germans take automotive engineering very seriously. The amount of power they can develop from smaller V8's and straight six donks, without resorting to underpowered 6-7 litre lumps is astounding. You only need to sit in a VW Golf or Audi A3 to realise the superior build quality they can produce compared to any GM product.

Street trim M5 versus development mule with roll cage :p
 

immortality

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funny really, but i lived in europe, and BMW's are there what holdens are here. nothing fancy. everyman and his dog will drive a BMW one year and then trade it for the Merc the next depending on what wins car of the year over there. i actually like BMW's just as you do, i think the M5 is a great car. however it's seriously overpriced and comparing anyhting in the "M" series to a standard commodore is no comparison. you would really have to compare it to say a high spec HSV because that is exactly what the M series is
 

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They are over priced here because of import taxes (thats why a lot more people are able to buy them overseas) and this rediculous notion about protecting the local industry. Thats one of the main reasons why Holden has poorly engineered and put together cars compared to other manufacturers.

Remove the taxes and dollar for dollar the Euro's take the prize.
 

Calaber

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Yeah I was gonna say, the euro trash part is a tad bit ignorant, considering the Germans take automotive engineering very seriously. The amount of power they can develop from smaller V8's and straight six donks, without resorting to underpowered 6-7 litre lumps is astounding. You only need to sit in a VW Golf or Audi A3 to realise the superior build quality they can produce compared to any GM product.

Street trim M5 versus development mule with roll cage :p
Having experienced a Mark V Golf from brand new, there are a couple of points I would like to make.

There can be no denying the standards of engineering achieved by the Germans, out of all the Euro manufacturers - in my opinion, Germany is heads and shoulders above France, Italy,Britain etc.

But from my experience, which obviously has since ceased, I was disappointed with various quality control issues.

In two and a half years, the Golf, a 2 litre FSI Comfortline manual, suffered the following faults.

1. Brake switch failure twice. The second time, I was fortunate that a replacement was available - the fault was so common that stocks were exhausted in Aus at that time. The first switch would not activate the brake lights unless you flattended the brake pedal to stop. Not adjustable, naturally. The second switch would short out at night when the temperature dropped, leaving the brake lights on for hours. Resulted in a flat battery - not impressed. By this time, Golf's lustre was wearing thin. Replaced under warranty.

2. Rear electric window switch failure - faulty from day one. Warranty.

3. Faulty trim on front passenger door. Warranty.

4. Persistent knocking sound when clutch was depressed, particularly noticeable at idle. Never attended to despite repeated requests. It turned out that this noise is common to all manual 2 litre Golfs. Hardly acceptable in my opinion. One of the reasons the car was traded.

5. Constant gear clash when changing from second to first at very low speeds. This was a common exercise because of the number of bloody roundabouts in this area. The car had little bottom end torque and as you had to almost stop so frequently, first gear was necessary. Crunch, crunch, crunch, nearly every time. Not fixed. The real reason the car was traded.

6. Ill fitting trim around rear window. Broken or bent clips during manufacture. Warranty.

7. Absolutely pathetic AM radio reception only 50 km from Sydney, because of the stupid aerial being stuck on the rear window. I noticed not long after selling our car that the factory had reverted to a whip aerial on later Golfs. And yes, I do listen to AM - can't stand the pathetic simpering of the male/female combos that the FM stations use for announcers/d.j.'s.


That was all within the 32 months we owned the car. It was bought brand new. A disappointing experience.

Sorry to hijack the thread.
 
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