VE Wheel on a VF

[vc commodore]

My understanding is that where the wheel can’t locate on the hub boss, a hub ring must be used to comply with current standards. As no hub ring was supplied with the wheel, it can correctly fit his vehicle, so it’s not fit for purpose (unless he was told a hub ring must be purchased at his cost prior to sale)…

Here’s one doc that discusses roadworthy requirements around hub wheel sloppiness:

It is certainly not good practice to fit a wheel which does not have a snug fit between the spigot hole and the wheel bearing hub or axle stub. This is supported by a requirement in the National Light Vehicle Modification Code of Practice (VSB14) which is called up in Victorian legislation that states “Replacement aluminium alloy rims must be located on the hub/axle by the same diameter centre spigot as the original wheel, using metal adaptor rings where necessary”.​

​

Therefore, if you encounter a situation where an aluminium alloy wheel does not fit snuggly on the central spigot, this is a cause for rejection in a roadworthiness test. ​

That was the first google hit but I’m sure other states have similar. But by all means substitute your view despite what is written.

As a side note, the fact that older vehicles were complied with older standards really isn’t relevant to later vehicles, otherwise I’d toss the cat converter and change the tune so I can get real throttle response on my 2017 commodore. But such would be rather illegal on my modern vehicle despite what is allowed on older pre ‘74 vehicles
Yes that would be interesting… Maybe the wheel wasn’t well centred and oscillated up and down a little, enough to be annoying, as he drove down the road?

Would be interested in how cars get approved with Romac axles then....

 

[J_D 2.0]

Would be interested in how cars get approved with Romac axles then....

Do you mean Romac floating hubs?
A) When getting a “roadworthy“ it’s not what you know but who you know.
B) How many later model vehicles would even be changed out for floating hubs seeing as SFA cars use live axles these days?

If the standard has only been relevant since the early 2000s a lot of the enthusiast cars using this setup would be older than the relevant standard as live axles went out of fashion in the late 1990s.

 

[Skylarking]

Would be interested in how cars get approved with Romac axles then....

Maybe its a bit of don't know, don't care... despite what is written

Regarding fit for use, in a tribunal they would look at what's actually written/legislated in determine whether something is fit for use as sold... And in Victoria, you'd be hard pressed to talking about Romac axles in justifying that VicRoads is wrong in their view about lack of hub rings and/or lack of tight fit to hubs being a roadworthy issue

 

[vc commodore]

Do you mean Romac floating hubs?
A) When getting a “roadworthy“ it’s not what you know but who you know.
B) How many later model vehicles would even be changed out for floating hubs seeing as SFA cars use live axles these days?

If the standard has only been relevant since the early 2000s a lot of the enthusiast cars using this setup would be older than the relevant standard as live axles went out of fashion in the late 1990s.

VZ Commodore 1 tonner...What axle has that got? That a start...
Not referring just to floating axles...Romac make both fixed and floating axles....

A quick read of skylarkings post of the doc, it hasn't got any date relating to it being a starting point...So with that in mind, seeing hub rings have only been in use since the 2000's and alloys have been around since the 70's, makes it an interesting discussion with the powers to be, especially seeing some factory alloys didn't locate on the hubs pre 2000 like they do on most post 2000 cars....The same principal also applies to factory steel rims...There are factory steel rims that don't locate snug on hubs, however there doesn't seem to be any write up concerning them.

 

[J_D 2.0]

VZ Commodore 1 tonner...What axle has that got? That a start...
Not referring just to floating axles...Romac make both fixed and floating axles....

A quick read of skylarkings post of the doc, it hasn't got any date relating to it being a starting point...So with that in mind, seeing hub rings have only been in use since the 2000's and alloys have been around since the 70's, makes it an interesting discussion with the powers to be, especially seeing some factory alloys didn't locate on the hubs pre 2000 like they do on most post 2000 cars....The same principal also applies to factory steel rims...There are factory steel rims that don't locate snug on hubs, however there doesn't seem to be any write up concerning them.

In any case manufacturers can do whatever they like (basically) and it gets approved regardless of what the actual rules are because they are the manufacturer. The rules really only apply to us plebs who modify our vehicles.

An example of this is the French car makers (Renault/Peugeot) who put blue tint on their whole windscreens. Illegal under Australian rules if you were to do it but manufacturers can do what they like.

Another example is quoted below where the manufacturer (Aprilia) can get certification under ADRs for an exhaust that is too loud according to the National Code of Practice!

The rules are convoluted and sometimes inconsistent even within the same government department! I suspect that’s by design just to keep you guessing and to make sure you can always be “in trouble” with the law should the need arise for them!

Excerpt from the article relating to the Aprilia example is below (URL at the bottom).

——————————————
“Returning to the example of the 2015 Aprilia Tuono 1100, clause 2.1.15 of the National Code of Practice achieves the absurd and unintended result that:

(a) the motorbike is certified to ADR 83/00 at a noise level of 107db(A) at 5500rpm; and

(b) despite such certification, it nevertheless contravenes clause 2.1.15 of the National Code of Practice as its stationary noise level is well above 94dB(A).”
——————————————

https://motorbikewriter.com/aftermarket-exhausts-not-illegal-barrister/

 

[VryBigPP]

TL;DR, the shop I bought from won't return the wheel for a variety of reasons, told me I should have known they were drilled for pre-VE before buying, etc etc. So I'm not getting a return on this.

How bad would it be for me to keep driving on this until I can get my hands on something that hasn't been drilled to fit pre-VE? Or alternatively, what could I do now to make it fit better? I can't seem to find any hub rings locally, and the only place I can see getting them is on eBay, with a 3 week shipping time.

 

[J_D 2.0]

TL;DR, the shop I bought from won't return the wheel for a variety of reasons, told me I should have known they were drilled for pre-VE before buying, etc etc. So I'm not getting a return on this.

How bad would it be for me to keep driving on this until I can get my hands on something that hasn't been drilled to fit pre-VE? Or alternatively, what could I do now to make it fit better? I can't seem to find any hub rings locally, and the only place I can see getting them is on eBay, with a 3 week shipping time.

Provided the rim goes correctly on the studs and it’s only the centre hub that isn’t seated properly it should be ok as the bevel on the wheel nuts should keep it in place.

If you are overly concerned about it you could find a local engineering place to make you a hub adapter as it would only take 10-20 minutes on a lathe to turn one out of aluminium.

Also if you aren’t already I’d be running that rim on the back. Less lateral movement to potentially loosen the wheel and a rear wheel coming off would be a lot easier to handle than a front one coming off.

 

[VryBigPP]

Provided the rim goes correctly on the studs and it’s only the centre hub that isn’t seated properly it should be ok as the bevel on the wheel nuts should keep it in place.

If you are overly concerned about it you could find a local engineering place to make you a hub adapter as it would only take 10-20 minutes on a lathe to turn one out of aluminium.

Also if you aren’t already I’d be running that rim on the back. Less lateral movement to potentially loosen the wheel and a rear wheel coming off would be a lot easier to handle than a front one coming off.

Yeah I've currently got it on the rear left, I was suggested to use a torque wrench to do up the lug nuts to 100nm, would this be beneficial to my situation?

And I reckon I'll consult an engineering place on Monday once they open up to see about getting one down

 

[lmoengnr]

If you have a tire place nearby that sells alloy wheels, they usually have hub rings.

Wheel nut torque per VE/VF is 170Nm.

 

[J_D 2.0]

Yeah I've currently got it on the rear left, I was suggested to use a torque wrench to do up the lug nuts to 100nm, would this be beneficial to my situation?

And I reckon I'll consult an engineering place on Monday once they open up to see about getting one down

I’d definitely make sure they are torqued to the correct spec. I assume you’ve already asked around tyre shops for the spacer? They would be the best starting point but if they don’t have anything then an engineering mob would be the next port of call.