Redline series 2 possible rwhp? And recommendations/ suggestions

[dassaur]

Put a harrop PD blower on it and leave everything else standard, no cams, no heads, no diff gears, just a blower

By the time you do cams, heads, exhaust and tuning you would close to what a blower costs, but the blower will make more power everywhere and drive like a standard car

If auto get the trans kitted and tuned

Or turbo.......

NA mods are poor bang for your buck

Sorry I must say I did misread you included exhaust in your factor, so add a few k.
But blower still needs tuning too.

 

[Ron Burgundy]

Does the 325 basic Gen F R8 make the same power as the VF2 SS despite the headers and larger exhaust?

I would say so. In this VF2 vs HSV 340 the difference is about half of claimed fwkw

 

[RevNev]

When auto cars are dyno'd if they don't have a 1:1 ratio gear and they it in the closest to 1:1 what does this do to the accuracy of the reading? Do gears that are let's say 1.15: 1 result in higher or lower dyno figures?

The taller the ratio, the less power they seem to show on the dyno. If you run a V8 in too low a gear, they'll wheelspin and ruin the reading.

 

[Forg]

Does the 325 basic Gen F R8 make the same power as the VF2 SS despite the headers and larger exhaust?

Appears to be the case ... HSV always made sure to use a different standard for quoting power then every mainstream manufacturer, so their numbers would sound bigger. Carrying on from HDT, although I don't think HDT ever quoted where their numbers came from (and their cars were always considerably slower than other cars that claimed the same power/weight).

Even though they were "overpriced" from the POV of a major manufacturer (by which I mean that if Holden had made the Gen-F2 Clubsport and sold as many of them as they sold Redlines, it would probably only have been a $15k premium over a Redline), I did think HSV generally did pretty well within the bounds they were allowed ... they didn't sell many cars, you need to sell a lot of cars to get back development costs of even a pissy piece of plastic like the last-hurrah GTS-R guards.
Holden probably spent as much on R&D for the VF2 bi-modal exhaust system as HSV spent on the entire LS3 intake + exhaust + tune ...

 

[RevNev]

Appears to be the case ... HSV always made sure to use a different standard for quoting power then every mainstream manufacturer, so their numbers would sound bigger. Carrying on from HDT, although I don't think HDT ever quoted where their numbers came from (and their cars were always considerably slower than other cars that claimed the same power/weight).

We've always had the impression that a Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT rated at 344kw is significantly stronger than HSV's 340. The LSA engine rated at 430kw although torquey, doesn't feel like 430kw as it lays over on the top end. The old HDT cars certainly weren't fast for their rated horsepower.

 

[RevNev]

In this VF2 vs HSV 340 the difference is about half of claimed fwkw

If the 340 was tested on an engine dyno and they would've had access to HRT's engine dyno, it's likely run up catless straight off the headers into the dyno cell's exhaust scavenging system to reach 340kw at the flywheel.

 

[PeteSS]

We had an original Dyno Dynamics 450 in 1997 and it read pretty close to 30% less at the wheels from the rated flywheel horsepower. A stock VN V8 (165kw) made about 155/160hp at the wheels. A VR GTS (215kw) made 200/205 rwhp. An LS3 (304kw) on the original dyno we'd expect around 285rwhp or 212rwkw. From the original software, every software upgrade Dyno Dynamics did read higher and started to make different power readings with gear and diff ratio changes. The original software made the same power regardless of what gear the car was run in and made no difference with a diff ratio change. The tractive effort or torque curve was different but not the horsepower as it should be.

Dyno Dynamics read similar in Shootout Mode although much higher readings than they did originally but they're sensitive to how a car is tied down and the gear ratios will change the readings a bit. Dynapak hub dynos seem to read the highest and Mainline dyno's seem to read a bit higher than our DD, but not always. There's not much "standard" involved with dyno calibration and you wouldn't want a torque wrench calibrated like a dyno, you'd be snapping bolts off, stripping threads or they'd be coming loose!

Dyno's are a good tuning tool and seeing improvements or losses on the same dyno with the same dyno operator. If you're jumping dyno shops testing mods, it's a waste of time and money really.

I still get confused with the 30% loss from flywheel to wheels.. Does that gap close the higher up you go in HP ?
For example, a VF that pulls 1000hp at the flywheel wouldn't lose 300hp by the time you measure it at the wheels ?

 

[PeteSS]

Appears to be the case ... HSV always made sure to use a different standard for quoting power then every mainstream manufacturer, so their numbers would sound bigger. Carrying on from HDT, although I don't think HDT ever quoted where their numbers came from (and their cars were always considerably slower than other cars that claimed the same power/weight).

Even though they were "overpriced" from the POV of a major manufacturer (by which I mean that if Holden had made the Gen-F2 Clubsport and sold as many of them as they sold Redlines, it would probably only have been a $15k premium over a Redline), I did think HSV generally did pretty well within the bounds they were allowed ... they didn't sell many cars, you need to sell a lot of cars to get back development costs of even a pissy piece of plastic like the last-hurrah GTS-R guards.
Holden probably spent as much on R&D for the VF2 bi-modal exhaust system as HSV spent on the entire LS3 intake + exhaust + tune ...

The HDT cars were measured in Brockowatts, as opposed to kilowatts . Hugely over optimistic power figures

 

[[paradox]]

I still get confused with the 30% loss from flywheel to wheels.. Does that gap close the higher up you go in HP ?
For example, a VF that pulls 1000hp at the flywheel wouldn't lose 300hp by the time you measure it at the wheels ?

basically no, the percentages of loss works for a stock car.
if you lose 40kw on a stock car, the amount of power required to turn the accessories and drive train does not magically increase if you add power mods.
so people who mod retune and get xxx rwkw and then magic up their fw kw based on that stock loss % are full of it.

 

[Skylarking]

We know different manufacturers measure HP using different standards. One standard can show a higher than the real figure for an “as delivered“configuration, as mentioned earlier. This means one manufacturers numbers aren’t comparable to another who uses the different standards. Then to make things interesting, manufacturers have also been known to underquote HP figures, especially in Japan so as to get around tax implications and/or “gentlemen‘s agreements”

There is no winning here, cause HP figures are just marketeers bragging rights brought to you from the least honest professions on our planet…, we’ll second only to politicians pre election promises

The only winning comparisons can only be made on time s at the drag strip or a given track