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1.9:1 ratio rockers to suit Buick (non ecotec) V6's

Discussion in 'Mace Engineering' started by MACE, Feb 14, 2010.

  1. vnmanual

    vnmanual New Member

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    so far i havent had any probs ticking engine runs sweeter and smoother than ever and new exhaust system has opened her up also
    the car is more pleasant to drive

    my mates p.o.s 304 v8 vs ute (standard motor, big pipes extractors) gets beaten off the line to over 100k every time, hes not happy, i think the 304 is a piece of low compression mud, it does nothing exciting anywhere in the rev range then goes flat. (my 2 cents)
    go the mighty buick!!

    i'm still after other people reponses to the install of these, i'm curious to know other peoples results. id love to see a before and after dyno

    cheers
     
  2. immortality

    immortality Home of the smoky breakfast Bacon! Staff Member

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    My rockers are fitted and i need to refit the intake manifold right after i deal to the sump full of petrol :eek:

    i have no doubt that they will completely enhance the way the s1 runs. the s1 was always quicker from a standing start however it ran out of puff to quick. these rockers will have fixed that issue.
     
  3. MACE

    MACE Well-Known Member

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    Bugger about the fuel :(
     
  4. crazybiker

    crazybiker Member

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    A retune would reap even better benefits after these rockers are installed right?
     
  5. lowvpcal

    lowvpcal Member

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    hi mace really sorry if this has already been asked but how much for a 93 vp v6 set and what does it include?
     
  6. LX_HATCH

    LX_HATCH Member

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    I changed the oil to 20W50 and the noise was still occuring.

    I have since left the Crow double valve springs on and put the standard rockers and pushrods back in and the noise disappeared.

    Im over it for now and might tackle it again next week.

    Regards Ryan
     
  7. MACE

    MACE Well-Known Member

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    It certainly would :)

    The price for the set is $585, including rockers, pedestals, pushrods rocker bolts and assembly lube.

    Ryan,

    I certainly understand your frustration. I was very close to throwing in the towel myself with this product all together. Spent many many hours on developing the kit for them to make sure they work on all of this range of Buick V6 engines. There may be something I’ve missed with your build but I’ll be emailing a heap of questions which will certainly go a long way towards diagnosing the problem. I'm 100% we'll get the problem sorted :)

    I had only suggested running thicker oil as the symptoms you communicated across (quite when cold, tappy when warm) may have indicated that oil pressure may have been a touch low for the lifters to control the extra force generated by the stiffer springs and higher ratio rockers.

    Shown below is one of the problems we’d experienced when developing this product.

    Yes that is a pushrod wrapped around the balance shaft due to a lapse in concentration when installing them :embarrass

    Cheers
    Steve
     

    Attached Files:

  8. LX_HATCH

    LX_HATCH Member

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    Ok Steve looking forward to your email.

    I have some more questions too that I will ask via email.

    Ryan
     
  9. vc81

    vc81 New Member

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    Steve, to what surfaces does the assembly lube need to be applied? Thanks.
     
  10. MACE

    MACE Well-Known Member

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    No probs Ryan :)

    Basically the assembly lube is applied to areas which make contact with the valve and push rod.

    Cheers
    Steve
     
  11. hsvanthony

    hsvanthony New Member

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    just installed mine before made a loud ticking nose after running for a few mins i killed it let it settle for halfa and when started again was better after pulling apart and going over everything 4times lol i started it again and then left it running for 5 10 mins then turned it off for a while and when starting AGAIN it sounded mint so all is good now drove it but kept the revs under 2 grand as i beleive in runing it in lol ill keep yous updated also thanks to steve from mace for putting up with my ballbreaker phone calls lol
     
  12. immortality

    immortality Home of the smoky breakfast Bacon! Staff Member

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    Yeah, i had the same issue on start up, engine stuttered a little. Although i had the rockers in and bolted up for a day before start up (allowing the lifters to bleed down a little) so it wasn't as bad. Steve has increased the lifter pre-load a little with the new rockers/push rods. This should results in a quieter valve train then when it was new.

    Something that may be worth a try if the lifters are noisy is running some Nulon "lifter free" even if it's just to give the hydraulic lifters a birthday. Seems to have made a improvement to mine overall :thumbsup:
     
  13. hsvanthony

    hsvanthony New Member

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    hey guys so the cars running all sweet now drove about 80ks last nite to let them run in then gave it a little bit to see seems to have gained in the top end so im happy, ill let you know more when ive tried it out more also. wouldnt mind hearing what other people who have put them in think? :) also will pulling my bellmouth help? :) thanks
     
  14. LX_HATCH

    LX_HATCH Member

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    Mines still sounding very rattly. Im just about out of ideas. Im taking it to a couple of mechanics that I know to get them to have a listen.

    Ive Changed the oil to 20W50
    Checked lifter pre load with original gear and mace 1.9:1 rockers both about 1.5 turns.
    Checked PTV clearance by getting piston at TDC and removing valve springs and dropping valve onto piston. There was ~10mm clearance here so its definately not an issue.
    Checked for coil bind very hard to tell but I don't think they are binding.

    Has anyone else on here fitted the crow valve springs with these rockers?
    They are a single spring with and dampener (which is like a flat internal spring).

    Ryan
     
  15. MACE

    MACE Well-Known Member

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    All good Anthony. That's what we're here for :) The lifters at times can take a little while to adjust to the new rockers (including on ecotecs) so the noise is nothing permanent.

    Ah glad to hear you're happy with them :) As for pulling out the bell mouth in this case they will help.

    Hey Ryan,

    Do you know what brand of lifters were installed in the rebuild?

    Have you checked the installed height of the springs?

    Please keep us posted.

    Cheers
    Steve
     
  16. LX_HATCH

    LX_HATCH Member

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    I spoke to the engine re conditioner and he said he wasn't sure about the brand as he gets them from a whole saler. But said the lifter are the same for Buick and Ecotec.

    What part does the brand of lifters play?

    Yes installed height is 1.7", crow data says closed height is about 1" and theres no way im getting 0.7" of lift, so it shouldn't be binding!!
     
  17. MACE

    MACE Well-Known Member

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    What part a specific brand of lifter does I couldn't tell you. But there are a few lifter manufactures around which may not be exactly the same as the genuine factory items. This can be a problem, depending on how they're designed, as they might not be able to dampen any changes in spring force as well.

    The factory, plain bearing, pressed steel rocker does a good job as dampening the valve train, however when we replace that with a much stiffer roller rocker, it does less of a job at dampening the valve train and becomes more reliant on other components such as the springs, pushrods and lifters to do that job. This can lead to unwanted valve train noise.

    I did get your email and have also forwarded it onto crow so we'll see how we go.

    Kindest Regards,
    Steve
     
  18. LX_HATCH

    LX_HATCH Member

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    Cheers Steve
     
  19. immortality

    immortality Home of the smoky breakfast Bacon! Staff Member

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    did a few errands today with a with a trailer on the back. with the high ratio rockers on you hardly noticed it was there, before the rockers you definitely knew when you had a trailer on the back as you definitely needed to use more throttle :D

    car pulled up much better too with the VT style Booster and MC
     
  20. MACE

    MACE Well-Known Member

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    And if you took it to the strip (without the trailer :p ) you'd notice the difference again :D

    On another note I really have to get around to upgrading the booster on mine :(
     

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