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Fuel issue on steep decline driveway?

snortings

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Well I've filled up a couple of days ago and I'll wait to see what happens when it starts to get around that halfway mark again, most likely the same issue will present. When it does happen for the first time I will take a photo of the fuel gauge to show where the level is at when the issue starts to occur.

Makes no sense as to how I'm going to explain this to the dealership, I feel like they will replace many things (at my cost) before they actually find the right solution for the issue. All I've got is a little video to show them, and then they'll have to go from there unless they can replicate it somehow.
 

Skylarking

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.... Makes no sense as to how I'm going to explain this to the dealership, I feel like they will replace many things (at my cost) before they actually find the right solution for the issue. All I've got is a little video to show them...
Demonstrating the problem via a video and an explanation that the problem occurs when pointing down your driveway should be more than ample in proving a problem exists. Then it's up to the dealer service department to localize the problem to a component to resolve the cause. The dealer service staff are supposed to be the experts after all.

But as the problem vehicle is a 2015 model, that you recently purchased, it may be that the manufactures warranty has expired since it is around 3 years old. So check the warranty status with Holden Customer Care to be sure. Regardless of the fact the manufacturers warranty may be expired, you still have a statutory warranty defined under Australian Consumer Law to fall back on. You also have a 3 month or 5,000 km statutory warranty on a used car to fall back on (though i'm not a fan of this warranty if the seller is not a Holden Dealer). My preference has always been ACL statutory warranty when the claim against a manufacturers warranty is denied or the manufactrurers warranty has expired.

It may be that the dealer, though it will most probably be you who, needs to discuss this issue with Holden to clarify what if anything Holden will cover under Australian Consumer Law or good will if their manufacturers warranty is expired.

Simply put, you should be covered under ACL ;)

So don't delay, put it to the dealer that it is unacceptable that such a young vehicle should have a starting issues when the car is on an slope. Be clear and tell them that you believe this issue constitutes a minor fault under Australian Consumer Law. Tell them you want it corrected so that you can rely on the vehicle to start even with low fuel in the tank (as any normal person would expect such to be the case).

If this issue can not be rectified as it's considered 'normal for this vehicle', tell them that you then consider the vehicle is 'unfit for purpose' under ACL as you can't rely on it starting when you need to drive to work in the morning. Then tell them that since it's unfit for purpose, you want a full purchase price refund as your chosen legally entitled remedy.

Sit back, wait for what you have said to the dealer and Holden to be digested and then it's likely all will be fixed at no cost to you :)

Finally, dealer diagnostics should never be a slap-shot process of replacing parts until they finally get to the faulty part, while billing you for all the parts and their lack of skill. That's just an old con job approach to fleece you of your hard earned. And note that vehicle repairs are also covered by Australian Consumer Law so service or repairs must be carried out in an appropriate standard, which slap-shot parts replacement is not.
 

snortings

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Demonstrating the problem via a video and an explanation that the problem occurs when pointing down your driveway should be more than ample in proving a problem exists. Then it's up to the dealer service department to localize the problem to a component to resolve the cause. The dealer service staff are supposed to be the experts after all.

But as the problem vehicle is a 2015 model, that you recently purchased, it may be that the manufactures warranty has expired since it is around 3 years old. So check the warranty status with Holden Customer Care to be sure. Regardless of the fact the manufacturers warranty may be expired, you still have a statutory warranty defined under Australian Consumer Law to fall back on. You also have a 3 month or 5,000 km statutory warranty on a used car to fall back on (though i'm not a fan of this warranty if the seller is not a Holden Dealer). My preference has always been ACL statutory warranty when the claim against a manufacturers warranty is denied or the manufactrurers warranty has expired.

It may be that the dealer, though it will most probably be you who, needs to discuss this issue with Holden to clarify what if anything Holden will cover under Australian Consumer Law or good will if their manufacturers warranty is expired.

Simply put, you should be covered under ACL ;)

So don't delay, put it to the dealer that it is unacceptable that such a young vehicle should have a starting issues when the car is on an slope. Be clear and tell them that you believe this issue constitutes a minor fault under Australian Consumer Law. Tell them you want it corrected so that you can rely on the vehicle to start even with low fuel in the tank (as any normal person would expect such to be the case).

If this issue can not be rectified as it's considered 'normal for this vehicle', tell them that you then consider the vehicle is 'unfit for purpose' under ACL as you can't rely on it starting when you need to drive to work in the morning. Then tell them that since it's unfit for purpose, you want a full purchase price refund as your chosen legally entitled remedy.

Sit back, wait for what you have said to the dealer and Holden to be digested and then it's likely all will be fixed at no cost to you :)

Finally, dealer diagnostics should never be a slap-shot process of replacing parts until they finally get to the faulty part, while billing you for all the parts and their lack of skill. That's just an old con job approach to fleece you of your hard earned. And note that vehicle repairs are also covered by Australian Consumer Law so service or repairs must be carried out in an appropriate standard, which slap-shot parts replacement is not.
Wow thanks, big reply :D

Does this all still apply if it was a private sale?
 

Skylarking

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Guess I should have had you clarify from whom you purchased the vehicle before I went keyboard crazy o_O

Sadly you don’t get any ACL statutory warranty or used car statutory warranty with private sales :oops:

You do get the transferable manufacturer’s warranty, if any is left on the vehicle, and any good will that Holden may provide if warranty has expired, even with a private purchases :) There may yet be a case for Holden to come to the party and show some good will ;)
 

snortings

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Update:
Now at 1/4 tank of fuel, and no starting issues yet. Though I’ve noticed a little grinding noise under the right side of the car when I did turn it on this morning, heard it a few days ago too. I wonder if this is the fuel pump? Drives fine though.

But two days ago it was idling around 480-500 and would fluctuate, doesn’t do it now. This sound like the pump is going out to anyone as well as the grinding noise?
 

Forg

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Isn’t a swirl pot about having a small fuel repository which will be full despite cornering etc when, without it, the pickup might be somewhere that’s not immersed in fuel?
Return line or not, there’s still value in it’s existence?
 

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Isn’t a swirl pot about having a small fuel repository which will be full despite cornering etc when, without it, the pickup might be somewhere that’s not immersed in fuel?
Return line or not, there’s still value in it’s existence?
For normal public road use, fuel starvation shouldn't occur with low fuel level unless one drives like fangio or the tank design and fuel pickup is rather poor. Even then, one only needs to slow down if it becomes an issue and pop into a petrol station to refuel. Problem solved.

But yes, swirl pots are used in situations where fuel starvation may be a problem when cornering or under hard acceleration. In those situaions the swirl pot is fed by another low presure pump to keep it toped up and the swirl pots i've seen are external to the tank.

What was mentioned earlier in the thread, which i think was supposition so i should go back and reread that post, was that an internal swirl pot existed in (some?) tanks. That could not be the case unless there was another low presure pump to keep it topped up or possibly the high presure pump return line kept it fed in some way but i've never seen an internal pot or baffles in a production tank.
 

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Another update... ran it down to the fuel light came on. No starting issues, though it seemed to be a little harsher on the gear changes for some reason. Sometimes under moderate throttle it’s like it wouldn’t get fuel for a split second and then it would pick back up. Not sure if that’s exactly what happened but im thinking off the top of my head.

This is starting to baffle me a lot, would the more noticeable gear changes be affected by this issue? I wouldn’t think so...

Where is the rev limiter meant to be in Park/Neutral? In my VE it was 4000 and it stayed very steady but tried it today and it was only 3000 and fluctuated up and down between 3000-3200.

Hope it isn’t on its way out, only 3 years old with 113,000 on the clock (previous owner had to travel for work). I’ve filled it up today so I’ll see what happens now.
 

Anthony121

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Another update... ran it down to the fuel light came on. No starting issues, though it seemed to be a little harsher on the gear changes for some reason. Sometimes under moderate throttle it’s like it wouldn’t get fuel for a split second and then it would pick back up. Not sure if that’s exactly what happened but im thinking off the top of my head.

This is starting to baffle me a lot, would the more noticeable gear changes be affected by this issue? I wouldn’t think so...

Where is the rev limiter meant to be in Park/Neutral? In my VE it was 4000 and it stayed very steady but tried it today and it was only 3000 and fluctuated up and down between 3000-3200.

Hope it isn’t on its way out, only 3 years old with 113,000 on the clock (previous owner had to travel for work). I’ve filled it up today so I’ll see what happens now.
I think V6 is about 3000 revs limited in park for SIDI engine. If your tacho fluctuates, you may have a vacuum leak. My VZ had this and it was the brake booster.
 

snortings

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Think it’s a fault with the engine of some sort, full tank and the issue still persists but now there is a grinding noise on startup. Got in the car this morning and it started fine but made a little grinding noise which came from the engine (or around it). Between then and this video the car has been turned on and off 4 times with no issue.

Went to move my car and thought I’d just record it to see if anything happens and sure enough it did. Towards the start of the video you can hear a little grind/knock of something and it really struggles to turn on. Don’t think it’s a fuel pump issue anymore as I said, it has a full tank of fuel.

Hope it’s not an expensive fix.. maybe @RiCeY knows this sound :D

Can’t really see this in the video, but it was moving side to side quite violently.

 
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