JC Political Thread - For All Things Political Part 2

[minux]

Minux has a point though. It's not just about being smart it's being prepared.

Apparently we have to pay for people who are neither smart nor prepared...apparently I am the only person who thinks this way.

Apparently locking everything up in your house is trying to be prepared. :blah blah:

Only idiots can defend idiots.

 

[vr94ss]

Apparently we have to pay for people who are neither smart nor prepared...apparently I am the only person who thinks this way.

Apparently locking everything up in your house is trying to be prepared. :blah blah:

Only idiots can defend idiots.

Only idiots think they are smarter than everyone else... Until it happens to them.

 

[SpaceYam]

Actually, I agree with Minux. In fact, I'm one of those unprepared people, but I would be more at risk of a normal house fire rather than a bushfire (unless embers were involved). I always have my wallet, phone and keys on me (my phone was damaged by water while FIGHTING the bushfires, but I'm not due any compensation for that. That was my own carelessness. See that? That's called "accountability"). Again, if your car is destroyed by fire and you do not have insurance - your own fault.

I don't have a problem with lending people a hand. What I do have a problem with is the expectation that you are OWED money due to a natural disaster. If the house I'm renting burned down I would be left with nothing but the clothes on my back and hopefully my car. Would the government compensate me for my loss? I seriously doubt it. So what would make me different in that scenario to the people who haven't actually lost anything? Why are they more deserving? If the government was going to pay them then they would have to compensate EVERY SINGLE VICTIM of any house fire. And could you imagine the class action for compensation for people who have suffered losses due to house fires over the last decade alone?

Now, sure, it would be nice if the government could give out free money to anyone who ever suffered some sort of genuine loss, but the fact is that there is less money to give and sacrifices have to be made somewhere. Of course, one of those sacrifices is fewer entitlements for MPs ... but one rule for them and us, hey?

I just don't see the point in compensating people who don't need compensation. As I said, the money will just turn into a new TV and beer, and that isn't helping anyone.

 

[c2105026]

I have never really lived in a bushland setting; we live in a housing estate on the edge of town, a few km away a grassfire sprung up and threatened a couple of homes a few years ago. If I did live in a bushfire prone area (I do not forsee this, by the way) I would doing everything I legally could to reduce risk, for I am a naturally anxious person. If the fire got near I would put key valuables in the VB (papers, journals, heirlooms, the cat), stay and try to fight (unless told by RFS it was simply too dangerous and just get out of there). OTOH some who lost houses were tragically occupied elsewhere fighting fires, helping out with relief effort, unable to leave their posts to get their belongings, protect their house etc. A couple of homes lost belonged to teachers and childcare workers who spent the day evacuating their students and looking after them. In that case loaded up VB would be taken to school.....but you never really know what will happen until the rubber hits the road.

 

[Reaper]

Actually, I agree with Minux. In fact, I'm one of those unprepared people, but I would be more at risk of a normal house fire rather than a bushfire (unless embers were involved). I always have my wallet, phone and keys on me (my phone was damaged by water while FIGHTING the bushfires, but I'm not due any compensation for that. That was my own carelessness. See that? That's called "accountability"). Again, if your car is destroyed by fire and you do not have insurance - your own fault.

I don't have a problem with lending people a hand. What I do have a problem with is the expectation that you are OWED money due to a natural disaster. If the house I'm renting burned down I would be left with nothing but the clothes on my back and hopefully my car. Would the government compensate me for my loss? I seriously doubt it. So what would make me different in that scenario to the people who haven't actually lost anything? Why are they more deserving? If the government was going to pay them then they would have to compensate EVERY SINGLE VICTIM of any house fire. And could you imagine the class action for compensation for people who have suffered losses due to house fires over the last decade alone?

Now, sure, it would be nice if the government could give out free money to anyone who ever suffered some sort of genuine loss, but the fact is that there is less money to give and sacrifices have to be made somewhere. Of course, one of those sacrifices is fewer entitlements for MPs ... but one rule for them and us, hey?

I just don't see the point in compensating people who don't need compensation. As I said, the money will just turn into a new TV and beer, and that isn't helping anyone.

You are talking about a party in politics that believed in sending $1000 (or whatever) cheques to dead people and expats (amongst others) in an effort to prop up the Australian economy during the GFC. Lets not let logic get in the way of a bleeding heart.

 

[Rufus®]

Not at all.

I grew up in a fire area, we lost a house during ash Wednesday. All our birth records, passport etc were stored in a safe deposit box, all our documents now, same thing unless we plan on using them within 48 hours. If you live in a fire area and you have no backups of such things you are an idiot.

Just for the record, my family was insured and got no handouts from any government. In fact they would have been too embarrassed to take one...far cry from today's feed me mentality like you defend above.

Off the subject. the biggest problem we face today is over population with poor education in bush fire prone areas. Throw this in with idiotic policies of minimal back burning and removal of dead timber...and well it is all another Black Saturday waiting to happen. We are currently looking at buying land in a bushfire area, some 290 acres, we requested from the council an interim approval to remove 210 tree's in a building area, we advised we would replant 1650 more across the property. We basically got laughed out of the council offices and told how important trees are etc and how we would need to look at building the house "within" the environment. Essentially councils are making people build their own potential coffins due to pathetic policy based on greens bullshit.

just curious, did you lose "a" house or "your" house?? big difference there...

 

[gopher]

Not at all.

I grew up in a fire area, we lost a house during ash Wednesday. All our birth records, passport etc were stored in a safe deposit box, all our documents now, same thing unless we plan on using them within 48 hours. .

and what happens if your house burnt down in that 48 hours that you let your guard down and had everything in there and not in your safe deposit box?

 

[vr94ss]

and what happens if your house burnt down in that 48 hours that you let your guard down and had everything in there and not in your safe deposit box?

You know what I find, is amusing the right word? These same people that are staying "suck it up" here are the same people that say we should not give foreign aid because we need to look after our own. The circle of compassion constantly shrinks as the need arises to fit their world view.

 

[gopher]

You know what I find, is amusing the right word? These same people that are staying "suck it up" here are the same people that say we should not give foreign aid because we need to look after our own. The circle of compassion constantly shrinks as the need arises to fit their world view.

Yeah I know.it disgusts me that these same people call themselves Australians.

As for the refusal to minux regarding tree clearing it would seem you stuffed up your perfect little world of being prepared for every scenario

 

[Calaber]

I don't have a problem with assisting those who lost everything due to the fires destroying their homes, BUT....

did they have insurance on their property and contents? The wise home owner at least covers themselves for these items, because to lose them is to lose everything you own. If you can't afford the insurance for the full amount, why not at least partly insure yourself and get something back, instead of being left with just the clothes on your back? I know that home insurance has skyrocketed in recent years - it's why I changed companies last year, but to fail to cover yourself for anything at all is just idiocy.

did they have to live amongst the trees? Living in close proximity to the Australian bush in areas like the Blue Mountains is taking a considerable risk that you WILL be threatened by fire at least once in your lifetime. What steps did they take to prevent their homes being destroyed? (and yes, I realise that just about any preparations would not have saved homes in the recent fires with the high velocity wind that was present).

Finally, did the home owners come up against the mindless stupidity that pervades local government these days with their tree preservation regulations? In the papers last week was reference to a Wyong home owner who was facing legal action from the Council for clearing an adjacent vacant block of dead lantana and bitou bush, which had been sprayed and killed off by Council workers, but not removed from the site. FFS, last time I looked, lantana and bitou were noxious plants and not protected, so what was all the fuss about and why couldn't the land owner clear them, seeing as the council was too lazy to do so?