[Ecotec] Ecotec balance shaft removal - Need advice

[shane_3800]

Not sure what you're trying to say mate. Are you suggesting that a counterbalancer doesn't take away unwanted vibration now? I do plenty of research, and I have plenty to learn just like everybody else.

I understand very well what a counter-balancer does, and why. But in the real world I recognise that some engines can (and do) live without them with no ill effect. These engines will die from other causes well before the lack of a counter-balancer will cause any noteworthy damage to them.

Only in the past few years has KTM started using counter-balancers in their 2 stroke EXC range. They've been revving to a minimum of 9k rpm for years without issue in the earlier models. However, the newer engines are noticeably smoother and the newer bikes don't fatigue the riders nearly as much because of this. Of course comfort plays a role when these machines are manufactured.

So the added vibration fatigues a person imagine what it's doing to all the small little engine components.

 

[Immortality]

No it's not true. But like the first article states issues can arise from the removal.
I would like to inspect the main bearings on a V6 with the delete done and see if one bearing has more wear than others. My hunch is the front main will have excessive wear and maybe even cap walk.

This V6 engine design has been around since the 60's and the balance shaft wasn't added till the 80's.

 

[EYY]

So the added vibration fatigues a person imagine what it's doing to all the small little engine components.

Nothing at all, otherwise all previous models would’ve had seriously compromised engine life.

There are allowable tolerances for everything in machine design. And then there are features to ensure ease of use and user comfort (not a necessity for reliable and effective operation).

It’s not black and white as you’re suggesting.

 

[shane_3800]

This V6 engine design has been around since the 60's and the balance shaft wasn't added till the 80's.

So you're saying going backwards in technolgy is better?
In that case why not put a flat tappet cam in an LS and carbies to go with........
So they had an engine for 20 years added a balance shaft the used that for the rest of production life.

 

[Immortality]

No, what I am saying is that this engine survived for decades without a balance shaft. The engine was revised to improve smoothness and comfort for the driver not because the engine would fail mechanically without it. The 3800 V6 engine has in inherent flaw in it's design which came about because it basically started as a 90º V8 with the rear 2 cylinders cut off which gave us a 90° V6.

 

[losh1971]

All I can see power gain in is loosing friction in the bearings and chain and no way that's 2rwkw as thats like 5fwhp.

Nah man, more like 3kw at the engine. I have 121.3kw at the wheels. Stock new is about 93rwkw. Power loss is more like a third, not 60%. If power loss was 60% then my gains are over 50rwkw using basic boltons. Wouldn't get that on an auto.

 

[shane_3800]

Nah man, more like 3kw at the engine. I have 121.3kw at the wheels. Stock new is about 93rwkw. Power loss is more like a third, not 60%. If power loss was 60% then my gains are over 50rwkw using basic boltons. Wouldn't get that on an auto.

check the units bro.

 

[losh1971]

check the units bro.

Not sure what you mean man? Stock is 93 and mine is 121.

 

[losh1971]

I am referring to the Buick.

 

[shane_3800]

Not sure what you mean man? Stock is 93 and mine is 121.

It's not going to gain any noticeable horsepower on a chassis dyno any way. The power gain is litterally imeasurable unless you have a eddy brake engine dyno.