Punctures

[vc commodore]

The last time I looked at those rope repair kits quite some years ago, they were clearly marked for temporary use only.

The intent of such repair kits was to get you to the nearest place of service where the tyre can either be repaired correctly or replaced. The correct repair process is (as VC mentioned) to first remove the tyre from the rim and then inspect the internals for associated damage. I fall looks ok and the puncture was through the tread and not near the sidewall/tread junction, the puncture is cleaned up and the inside surface roughed up so a much room plug can be inserted into the hole from the inside and pulled hard from the outside so the mushroom top sits flat against the inside of the tyre. I believe they also use some vulcanising glue under the mushroom head and stem.

Such mushroom plug repairs and only on certain parts of the tyre tread are safe. In all other cases one should replace the tyre...

As for that tyre sealant goop, it’s also for temporary use only. The last time I looked at some, there was a clear warning not to use on motorbikes as it can impact tyre balance which is critical when you only have two wheels. It also had a warning not to use it on wheels with tyre pressure monitoring systems installed (though I think they have better fluids these days as Holden uses such in their tight arse standard tyre repair kits). ALL tyre shops hate sealant goop as it’s messy to deal and supposedly a smells though I’ve not had the privilege I’d hate cleaning such crap from rims ifI worked in tyre repair business (which means it probably isn’t cleaned up terribly well impacting balance

The reality is, a quality full size spare tyre is the only safe* way to repair a flat for anything other than an emergency get me to a tyre joint situation. And don’t bag the guys if they hate working with wheels that have Tyre goop used on them or they charge more in such cases...

* changing tyres or using sealing rope/goop on the side of the road carries its own risks if one doesn’t have their mind on safety. The safety aspects of such roadside repairs should be taught as part of ones road skills development and such should be a part of any license test... but meh, our rulers probably think Darwinism

You are correct that these rope seal kits and goop crud is marked for temporary use only.....The thing that concerns me the most, as I have mentioned, is the damage inside the tyre that can't be seen without removing the tyre and the tyre failing as a result of using these temporary repair kits....

I am also aware 4wders love them, but with all the stuff they carry when going 4wding, a few other basic items in their kit can also mean they can repair a tyre out in the bush and not resort of these kits

 

[vc commodore]

Good point. Although I usually fix mine without running them flat. Can usually tell from the handling that something is off long before the .Different story I suppose if drove a long distance without noticing. Out of interest, assuming someone did run the tyre flat, then had it removed from the rim and tyre shop couldn't see any visual damage inside the tyre, what would be the go to way to repair it?

The internal visible signs of it being run flat are a dark line around the edge where the sidewall meets the main tread surface area of the tyre.....Providing there are no signs of this, the foreign item is removed and the hole is enlarged slightly and a mushroom plug inserted.....A mushroom plug has a round flat base, with a rubber stalk, which goes through the enlarged hole in the tread, to seal it fully...If it isn't sealed fully, there is a chance water enters into the carcus and cause the steel belts to rust and fail.....

The other signs to look for are signs the foreign object has rubbed the sidewall of the tyre....Some objects can enter in the repair zone of the tyre, but actually bend around and rub the sidewall.....I have seen numerous examples of this, however what can occur and unfortunately does, is people use these temporary repair kits and don't actually realise that the object has actually rubbed on the sidewall....When this occurs, the tyre is turfed...

I have also seen examples where a foreign object has entered the tyre and looks innocient enough from the outer, where someone would use a rope plug or goop, however when inspected inside, it has actually broken some of the steel belts of the tyre....When this occurs, the tyre has to be turfed, as it can lead to delamination

So more reasons why these kits are fraught with danger

 

[Jack GS]

This thread has really enlightened me, or at least made me think twice about the plug kits. I have used those plug kits in various applications since I was a kid (heavy farm equipment, ATVs, and cars). If applied properly, they held for the lifetime of the tire. I have never, and will never, use the goop but I still keep a plug kit in my emergency toolkit.

When I took my flat into the dealer, they stated they will plug/patch any small puncture in the tread that's more than three fingers from the sidewall. If the puncture is within three fingers to the sidewall, the tire must be replaced. I didn't ask for their reasoning at the time but I'm somewhat curious now. So, if the dealerships are employing plugs as a "permanent" fix, are they actually as bad as the previous posts indicate? Genuine question, not trying to stir the pot here. My tire was not removed for inspection either, FWIW. The tire deflated while the car was parked.

 

[vc commodore]

This thread has really enlightened me, or at least made me think twice about the plug kits. I have used those plug kits in various applications since I was a kid (heavy farm equipment, ATVs, and cars). If applied properly, they held for the lifetime of the tire. I have never, and will never, use the goop but I still keep a plug kit in my emergency toolkit.

When I took my flat into the dealer, they stated they will plug/patch any small puncture in the tread that's more than three fingers from the sidewall. If the puncture is within three fingers to the sidewall, the tire must be replaced. I didn't ask for their reasoning at the time but I'm somewhat curious now. So, if the dealerships are employing plugs as a "permanent" fix, are they actually as bad as the previous posts indicate? Genuine question, not trying to stir the pot here. My tire was not removed for inspection either, FWIW. The tire deflated while the car was parked.

Those plugs are suited to slow speed stuff, but not cars/4wd /trucks.....What has occurred over time is, the plugs have actually come out and caused rapid deflation of the tyre....Rapid deflation can cause an accident....It is also mandatory for a mushroom plug to be fitted so the puncture is sealed properly.

The dealership best look up industry standards in relation of the proper way to repair a puncture, rather than wack a rope plug in....

 

[Skylarking]

@Jack GS rope type plugs are pushed in from the outside of the tyre using what looks like a big needle on a T handle. Such are really are only to be used if you're stuck in the middle of nowhere in your 4x4 and you've got no other options available, that is, they are emergency temporary repairs... Sadly some owners continue to drive like there is nothing compromised about a rope plug repairs and then fail to get a safe repair or replace the tyre at the earliest opportunity...

A franchised service department (like Holden dealers used to be) would never use a rope plug in any tyre repair if they understand leagal liability issues. They'd use a mushroom plug that is installed from the inside after demounting the the from the rim but by far the best option is a new tyre...

No plug repair (rope or mushroom) should ever be done on a tyre sidewall or near a tyre sidewall. That's because these areas generate the most heat and as such they wont hold up and likely cause a catastrophic failurer. Such is less the case with a mushroom plug repair within the tread area (and away from the sidewall junction).

After all, even small engined modern shitboxes can drive at ludicrous speeds these days... And as such, since we aren't putting around in model-T fords any longer, we require much more from our tyres than ever before...

As a parting note, tyres are speed rated and it's illegal to install a lower speed rated tyre than what's listed on the tyre placard (in some instances it can be done but a warning label must be fixed to the windscreen within the drivers view). Yet i've never read any reports on how much the speed rating may be degraded by using a repaired tyre... but i'm certain it would be degraded... @vc commodore may have some knowledge on such speed derating of repaired tyres as he works within the industry.

 

[vc commodore]

@Jack GS rope type plugs are pushed in from the outside of the tyre using what looks like a big needle on a T handle. Such are really are only to be used if you're stuck in the middle of nowhere in your 4x4 and you've got no other options available, that is, they are emergency temporary repairs... Sadly some owners continue to drive like there is nothing compromised about a rope plug repairs and then fail to get a safe repair or replace the tyre at the earliest opportunity...

A franchised service department (like Holden dealers used to be) would never use a rope plug in any tyre repair if they understand leagal liability issues. They'd use a mushroom plug that is installed from the inside after demounting the the from the rim but by far the best option is a new tyre...

No plug repair (rope or mushroom) should ever be done on a tyre sidewall or near a tyre sidewall. That's because these areas generate the most heat and as such they wont hold up and likely cause a catastrophic failurer. Such is less the case with a mushroom plug repair within the tread area (and away from the sidewall junction).

After all, even small engined modern shitboxes can drive at ludicrous speeds these days... And as such, since we aren't putting around in model-T fords any longer, we require much more from our tyres than ever before...

As a parting note, tyres are speed rated and it's illegal to install a lower speed rated tyre than what's listed on the tyre placard (in some instances it can be done but a warning label must be fixed to the windscreen within the drivers view). Yet i've never read any reports on how much the speed rating may be degraded by using a repaired tyre... but i'm certain it would be degraded... @vc commodore may have some knowledge on such speed derating of repaired tyres as he works within the industry.

A repair isn't done near the sidewall because that's where the strength of the tyre is...Heat hasn't got a lot to do with it in that respect.

As for degrading of the speed rating...Never ever checked into it...I'm only aware of the proper procedure to follow when repairing a tyre so it is safe to use on a vehcile

 

[Badgerdog]

I've had 3 punctures with my Continental sport contact 5's in 27,000 km's. I've never been that unlucky before. I have read (sorry can't remember where) that these are a bit more vulnerable but it could just be bad luck.

 

[vc commodore]

I've had 3 punctures with my Continental sport contact 5's in 27,000 km's. I've never been that unlucky before. I have read (sorry can't remember where) that these are a bit more vulnerable but it could just be bad luck.

New tyres are more vulnerable that older ones due to the rubber being softer allowing foreign objects to pearce through the rubber easier....

 

[87VLCALAIS]

New tyres are more vulnerable that older ones due to the rubber being softer allowing foreign objects to pearce through the rubber easier....

That doesn't explain the greater number of punctures I've had with the Continental Conti Sport tyres. I've had many sets of new tyres without having punctures.

 

[vc commodore]

That doesn't explain the greater number of punctures I've had with the Continental Conti Sport tyres. I've had many sets of new tyres without having punctures.

You have been unlucky....No particular brand is more susceptible than the next