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WARNING LS3 Recall about to happen

Discussion in 'VF Holden Commodore (2013 - 2017)' started by GMVPSS, Dec 1, 2017.

  1. Skylarking

    Skylarking Well-Known Member

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    @Over 60 i’m glad it got sorted but it shouldn’t have taken such an effort on your part. The Holden trained service department should have handled this professionally and without error or drama.

    In my book, if a service department can’t handle a simple service bulletin to change a seal, training or competency is a real issue and needs to be addressed. Likely the organisation needs a new service manager to lift the standard to where they should be.

    As for HCC, it’s an organisation with poor processes that relies on the customer ringing about some issue (and likely angry about it when ringing) before they address the concern. There seems to be no desire to improve the processes to avoid the issues that result in a customer ringing up in the first instance. It’s a typical call center mentality but without an ability to have things escalated to a manager or senior exec for the more serious matters.

    It’s all a sad indictment that will likely lead Holden into oblivion.
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2018
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  2. SSteve

    SSteve Active Member

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    For those interested...Holden honoured the free service that was promised after the rocker arm issue. Had the 9 month service (cars done 3500km) on the weekend. $0
    Had the letter with me ready to slap it on the counter if I was invoiced!...it was not needed.
     
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  3. VFII•17

    VFII•17 Well-Known Member

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    I had to pay for my first service.. but I had no recall either..

    We are performing the rocker arm recall as we sell cars. Our last Motorsport just got delivered last week (sold by me) and we have a few Redline wagons left, as well as one manual Redline sedan and a couple of Calais-V wagons still remain for sale - 7 year warranty still applies, if anyone is interested.
     
  4. VL Executive

    VL Executive VY SS Ute - Just got 1!

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    I had the HVAC seal done on mine today.
     
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  5. HighViz

    HighViz New Member

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    Damn i love it how Holden do a recall on a part that isn't a safety concern, yet they don't feel concerned enough to do a recall on the faulty power steering racks in the all years and models of the australian vf range.....but they do to the USA delivered range! Which is so dangerous it's not funny!
     
  6. Paul Smedley

    Paul Smedley Member

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    I think you'll find that both the HVAC seal and the rocker arm are *not* recalls - they're 'service update' items. The steering rack issue does not impact "all years and modes" of the Australian VF range, note the end date of the range of the US recall in https://gm.oemdtc.com/7443/17167-01...-chevrolet-caprice-police-pursuit-vehicle-ppv

    There's some background as to why the US police recall happened in http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-04-...f-holden-caprice-power-steering-fault/7348812 - police cars sit idling a LOT
     
  7. immortality

    immortality Home of the smoky breakfast Bacon! Staff Member

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    ^^^ doesn't change the fact that steering failure is a major safety issue and if there is a known issue that causes the system to fail than it should be a recall. There are enough examples of steering failures on this forum alone to warrant further investigation.

    GM/Holden know that should a police vehicles steering fail during a high speed persuit as is common in the US that the liability from injury/death and damage would be substantial. Basically put, the average joe liability is a lot less than public service (aka the police) liability.

    Not that a wish for someone to get killed but should it ever happen, I hope GM/Holden get taken to the cleaners.
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2018
  8. lmoengnr

    lmoengnr Well-Known Member

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    Is it an actual 'steering failure', or 'loss of power assistance'?
     
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  9. Paul Smedley

    Paul Smedley Member

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    It is a 'loss of power assistance', not a 'steering failure'
     
  10. Paul Smedley

    Paul Smedley Member

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    What makes you think there hasn't been an investigation?
     
  11. immortality

    immortality Home of the smoky breakfast Bacon! Staff Member

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    That maybe the case but unless you're a decent sized bloke you're simply not going to be able to turn the wheel so although it may not be a total failure it is bad enough that the average person may very well not be able to negotiate an obstacle in front.

    Put it this way, would you be happy for your wife to drive the car in that condition and are you comfortable that she would be able to turn the wheel in case of "loss of power assistance" ?

    The fact that Holden changed something during the production cycle proves this is a genuine problem.

    At the end of the day you can argue the technicalities of the term used to officially describe the problem but it doesn't change the fact that when the fault occurs the steering becomes difficult if not impossible to turn ( can quote the article you linked above with the taxi driver if required). If this is not dangerous then quiet frankly I don't know what dangerous is. If you go and look through the various threads on this forum there are plenty of instances of this fault occuring and the fright/horror of the driver in trying to negotiate the turn (as this fault occurs when turning). Do we want to wait until this happens and it becomes a major accident with serious injury or fatality?

    There probably was and the the powers that be made sure the outcome was "loss of power steering assist" because that doesn't sound to bad and therefore not a recall.

    Wonder how that will sound when one day the same sentence is used in the coroners report, " cause of death was the result of major injuries sustained when the vehicle been driven had a sudden "loss of power steering assistance" whilst negotiating a turn". Followed some paragraphs later by " the manufacturer was fully aware off this power steering assistance failure problem but had not rectified the issue with a recall in Australia but did so in the United States and is therefor fully liable for the death of this victim"

    Just think about it, it's a real posibility.

    edit: And this is where the bean counters come in, simple math, cost of full recall Vs the cost of liability when death occurs due to said fault. GM is well known for doing exaclty this and not recalling major faults.

    edit2: What was it Holden recently said about it been a good corporate citizen in Australia and doing the right thing? ...
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2018
  12. VS 5.0

    VS 5.0 Well-Known Member

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    .....to the ACCC in a court enforceable undertaking agreeing not to fcuk consumers over ?
     
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  13. lmoengnr

    lmoengnr Well-Known Member

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    What's the difference between a VF loosing electric power assistance and a hydraulically steered vehicle breaking an accessory drive belt?
     
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  14. immortality

    immortality Home of the smoky breakfast Bacon! Staff Member

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    It's hard to say, I'm a big bloke so what I consider hard and what others consider hard are 2 differnt things. I tend to judge it more on if my missus could handle the problem. Even with the older hydraulic power steering if you lost the engine/belt the steering went fairly damn hard. I always make sure the belt and pulleys are in good nic and have never lost a belt yet. I have towed the odd one and I would have the missus drive the tow car every time as the steering becomes hard. I've not had first hand experience with the electrical steering failure but from the accounts on this forum it's seems worse.

    To quote the article linked above,

    Taxi driver Daljeet Singh said he was on Melbourne's Bolte Bridge when his steering wheel locked up.

    "My steering got so hard I can't move at all, so I was in a position to collide to the other car," he said.

    Mr Singh said he had to lean on the wheel with some force, to get him over to the emergency lane.

    "And when I called Holden they said that's a normal problem, you just turn off the car and turn it on again and it'll be alright," he said.


    Mr Singh said he has had this problem 25 times.

    "I have taken it back to the dealership, what they're doing is they're putting on a softer gel, they're cleaning it and putting on a sort of a gel, just a temporary fix," Mr Singh said.

    Last time I checked, it is simply not possible to simply turn off a vehicle whilst moving to reset a fault in a safe manor at any speed or in traffic. To say this is normal is lunacy in my humble opinion.
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2018
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  15. HighViz

    HighViz New Member

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    So just because a police car sits on idle for a longer period of time than normal, someone in a white coat from Holden determined that their cars would definitely fail so they deserve to be fully recalled over EVERYONE else who has the exact same steering rack and all we get is a regrease of the faulty part or maybe a new steering rack if your lucky to have a warranty still, if your car is out of warranty, you can forget getting anything done at no cost.....you have to pay for them to "diagnose" the problem (even though we already know what it is) i got quoted $145 dollars just for that, which would consist of them hooking up their scan tool, click a few buttons and presto....open your wallet! And then got quoted $2000 to replace the steering rack if it is found to be faulty! Are you friggin kidding me.

    Anyone who has had this happen to them knows how dangerous it is....l had it happened to me last friday night, i was extremely lucky to have just been taking off so i didn't move far!
    I'm not small and have driven cars that had power steering and those that don't, and let me tell you that driving a car that has no power steering at all ie: An old FJ would feel like it had power steering compared to trying to turn the wheel when i had a "loss of power steering assistance" I honestly cannot believe no one has been killed yet with this fault but it is only a matter of time!

    There is not a snowballs chance in hell that i'm going to pay for any of that steering to be fixed!
    I would go to holden with an oxy torch and cut one out of there showroom floor cars before that happens
     
  16. Redline 2017

    Redline 2017 Active Member

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    That sounds like a **** time indeed What model do you have? I havent heard of anyone having to foot the bill for a rack swap yet. I'm not sure that gels with the major failure part of Australian consumer law. Best of luck
     
  17. immortality

    immortality Home of the smoky breakfast Bacon! Staff Member

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    There is a dedicated thread to this Power steering failure (i'll call it how I see it). Go check it out, see what the others have done to get it repaired.

    Once that is all sorted maybe take it one step further and make a formal complaint about the rack and lack of official recall to ACCC or whom ever is the watch dog over there.
     
  18. VS 5.0

    VS 5.0 Well-Known Member

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    Banjo79 and lmoengnr like this.
  19. immortality

    immortality Home of the smoky breakfast Bacon! Staff Member

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    Check out this thread sudden-loss-of-power-steering-when-driving It has all the info needed to get the repair done.

    Don't go in all gungho, start off polite but have the info from the thread above if they play hardball. Some stealerships are better than others when dealing with this issue.
     
  20. HighViz

    HighViz New Member

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    Thanks guys for all the info and help, i am currently looking into it with a holden specialist so here's hoping it all goes smoothly!
    And too Redline2017, it is a 2013 fantail VF SS Redline with 69,000kms....na (for now) with 320rwkw and over 700nm torque
     
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