Zb commorde haters

[Calaber]

No. The argument here is that it was called Commodore despite it having almost zero Commodore attributes.

So, if it had a V8 and RWD, but had been called an Insignia, or anything but Commodore, it would have sold better? Do you really believe it failed just because of the name?

 

[Immortality]

I think trading on the Commodore badge is part of the reason but certainly not the main reason. They should have advertised the Insignia on its merits rather than rely on the Commodore name plate and complete lack of promotion it got.

 

[figjam]

So, if it had a V8 and RWD,

………. and was an imported RHD rebadged Cadillac Commodore, with a starting price of AU$75K, would that have sold ?

 

[VS 5.0]

Do you really believe it failed just because of the name?

I think it would be a significant contributor.

As has been raised by other(s) in the past, traditional Commodore buyers not interested coz not made in Aus, not RWD, no V8, no manual, yadda, yadda, yadda. Non traditional Commodore buyers not interested coz Commodore and all the things attached to that.....bogans, beers & burnouts, badge snobbery etc etc etc. Pretty much no man's land. The curious and the fleet buyers were probably attracted but not many, if any, from those other demographics.

Combined with the whole shift to SUV.....well we all know the rest.

 

[Brettly-2008]

So, if it had a V8 and RWD, but had been called an Insignia, or anything but Commodore, it would have sold better? Do you really believe it failed just because of the name?

I don't know, that's not the point I was making. But now you ask, historically that's exactly what happened with the original VB Commodore. I also reckon there would've been quite a few VE-VF V8 owners willing to take the plunge with a cut-price V8 Euro RWD sedan to replace the outgoing Aussie-built version. Sadly, that still wouldn't have been enough as we all know.

 

[Calaber]

If we all think back just four years, when the VF 2 was a year from extinction, it was only selling around 2,000 cars a month many of them corporate orders. Private buyers were deserting the Commodore in droves, and it was still locally made, RWD, V8 available yadda yadda. All those things missing from the ZB, yet only enthusiasts were interested and they made up about 40% or 800 nuyers a month. So, maybe 10, 000 cars a year at best. We know that was never enough to sustain local production. We also know that attempts to market the earlier Insignia under the Opel banner failed. So, why do people honestly think that using a failed nameplate, and offering a power train that only around 10, 000 people wanted, would have meant success for the ZB? Let's not also forget that once it went out of production, even fewer people were interested in the last VF2's. Instead of blaming the car, or its name, or the lack of a V8 etc, why can't people accept that the Australian motoring public, in common with the US and other foreign countries, had moved on and didn't want sedans any more?

 

[mpower]

image, product, quality, service - you name it GM crapped the bed on every level - and not just recently for years now.

every now and again you get something good - but overall meh.

 

[Brettly-2008]

If we all think back just four years, when the VF 2 was a year from extinction, it was only selling around 2,000 cars a month many of them corporate orders. Private buyers were deserting the Commodore in droves, and it was still locally made, RWD, V8 available yadda yadda. All those things missing from the ZB, yet only enthusiasts were interested and they made up about 40% or 800 nuyers a month. So, maybe 10, 000 cars a year at best. We know that was never enough to sustain local production. We also know that attempts to market the earlier Insignia under the Opel banner failed. So, why do people honestly think that using a failed nameplate, and offering a power train that only around 10, 000 people wanted, would have meant success for the ZB? Let's not also forget that once it went out of production, even fewer people were interested in the last VF2's. Instead of blaming the car, or its name, or the lack of a V8 etc, why can't people accept that the Australian motoring public, in common with the US and other foreign countries, had moved on and didn't want sedans any more?

Yep, of course you're right, everyone knows this. But there's a couple of other points/truths you may want to take in that myself and plenty of others have made across numerous threads:

-Holden WOULD'VE sold more more if it was developed with rear-wheel-drive and had a V8 option. Whether it was enough is moot.
-ZB is NOT a Commodore in its current specification. Lots of buyers saw this and some at least likely didn't buy for this reason.

 

[Skylarking]

So, if it had a V8 and RWD, but had been called an Insignia, or anything but Commodore, it would have sold better? Do you really believe it failed just because of the name?

The previous insignia wasn’t a bad car, quite good in fact, but it just wasn’t advertised. It also wasn’t to be seen on the lot. Unsurprisingly it sold in counts manageable on the one hand

Then the ZB comes along, and with all the market and company uncertainty, how does management handle it. A lack of advertising along with a large increase in price, other than on the base model, is how. SNFU. So, I’d suspect these facts would have added a few nails to the commodore coffin and almost certainly to Holden itself

 

[Calaber]

Yep, of course you're right, everyone knows this. But there's a couple of other points/truths you may want to take in that myself and plenty of others have made across numerous threads:

-Holden WOULD'VE sold more more if it was developed with rear-wheel-drive and had a V8 option. Whether it was enough is moot.
-ZB is NOT a Commodore in its current specification. Lots of buyers saw this and some at least likely didn't buy for this reason.

The cost to develop an exclusive V8 RWD model would have cost a bomb and it's quite likely the cost would not have been amortised by the number sold. The fact that many of the last VF's were V8's and were still sitting in dealers yards in 2019, isn't only because of ridiculous prices. The buyers just weren't there. I doubt a V8 ZB's reception would have reversed that trend to GM's satisfaction. They dropped the car from their US lineup and their sales far exceeded ours.